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So the big decision that Donnie Walsh has in terms of Jason Kidd isn’t the amount of money, 
that much is set, at least for this year. The question is just how many years he’s willing to give the free agent ex-Net.
AW thinks that the Knicks will only offer one year-
“…The Knicks are unlikely to give Kidd more than a one-year deal for the midlevel exception around $5 million, while Dallas would likely pay him a contract with a beginning salary around $8 million…”
and according to Alan Hahn the Knicks are comfortable going three:
“…Donnie Walsh, do you agree with the 2-to-3 year projection? “Yeah. And he played very well this year, which is why Dallas wants to keep him.”
Walsh paid Kidd the highest compliment when he said that Kidd “stands for everything that I’d like a basketball team to stand for . . . He has a way of bringing people together…”
To me it makes sense to give Kidd 3 years if that were the deciding factor, but I don’t think it is. Kidd is definitely using the Knicks as leverage. He’ll take the money, but why on earth would he take it in Dallas? Kidd wants a ring, he’s literally the Patrick Ewing of point guards, one of the best ever at the position who has a huge missing piece.
Dallas’ success last year was fool’s gold. They, like Kidd, are on the other side of the mountain. Mark Cuban knows that if he lets Kidd walk for nothing, he hastily made one of the NBA’s worst trades to get him from the Nets. And we all know how sensitive the man is.
Kidd would come here and make a difference in year one, and then he’d have to maintain his health and Mike D’Antoni would have to monitor his minutes in order to sustain Kidd for the duration of his contract.
Bringing Kidd in is a sign that players love what the team is doing here. It would send a message to the league and would make the Knicks a .500 team instantaneously, in my opinion.
But does Kidd pass on the money…and do the Knicks go three years.
Those seem to be the important questions right now.
Kidd would be crazy to come to the Knicks for 1 year or 3 years at the mid-level. Honestly, I don’t see any reason in bringing him in the first place. This move and Grant Hill as well, reeks of desperation to try to move from crappy team to mediocre team.
Who’s next Iverson??
This can’t be serious. 3 years for Jason Kidd. This will kill any chance of getting two max free agents next year. Is a 36-year old Jason Kidd who is probably the worst defensive pg in the league at this point worth that? Not even close. If they do this, I’m done, officially done with this short-sighted, incompetent management. This team will never be anything until Dolan sells the team. The fact that it is even being entertained is silly. This is all about leverage against the Mavs.
AI’s still a better player and plays with more tenacity than anybody on our team….not saying I would want him, but i’m just saying….
Tommy: can you see a much bigger trade with Dallas so each team gets something. We have trading pieces in Nate Robinson, Jared Jeffries and Eddy Curry. Dallas has Jason Kidd, Jerry Stackhouse and Antoine Wright. What might Dallas want and what might they want to give up? Your thoughts.
You call Eddy Curry a trading piece…haah
Why give 3-years to a collapsing 36 year old?
Let’s be real.
Kidd is talking to NY because his Kids are in the area and he personally likes NYC and D’Antoni.
I agree that Dallas is on the other side of the hill though. They are teetering on being a lottery team next near.
I’ve no problem with bringing Kidd on board but what does that mean for the 2010 plan?
Does Donnie have a taker for Jeffries or (one can hope) Curry?
Should we lay out 6 mil per for Kidd over 3 years it will affect our ability to get our Free Agents on 2010. And Kidd is 37 years old for chissakes.
Maybe he splits time with Duhon — each getting 25 or so a game but we know it never works out that way. Especially with Coach D’s short rotations./
If it is a two year deal it might as well be three because after the 2nd year our cap really doesnt matter
From what I recall, Jason Kidd is not the kind of high percentage shooter that D’antoni would prefer.
His shooting did improve last year though, I think he shot over 40% in 3s. Either way I dont want hi,
Sure Jason Kidd is not getting any younger but he’s still one of the top point guards still in the league. He still knows how to get the ball moving in an offense. He didn’t look like he showed signs of slowing down last year in my opinion – he played 81 games in the regular season with an average of 35.6 minutes per game. While averaging 9.0 ppg (was never a big scorer), 6.2 rebounds and 8.7 assists. And according to his stats he had the lowest turnovers in his nba career last year!
John Stockton played till he was 41 and he was still better than alot of the point guards in the league in his final season. Whats to say that Jason Kidd will not be able to play another 2-3 years also when his strength is passing and basketball IQ not athletism or shooting.
If Walsh wants Jason Kidd then how is he not just dying to have Rubio. Rubio is everything Kidd is but 20 years younger, with more craftiness.
I don’t like this – does this mean we’re giving up on Rubio? If so, Walsh absolutely failed. That deal with Washington should’ve got done.
Kidd had a nice year last year. But even with another star like Nowitzki, the Mavs didn’t do too much. For the record, the Knicks have nothing close to a Dirk Nowitzki.
The plan all this time should have been to get Rubio. Donnie should have made that happen. Now we are looking at a bunch of old NBA guys. Kidd still has something left but what happend to our plan to get younger and develop talent? I really dont understand whats going on.
For everyone saying Detroit didn’t give Gordon $11m to be the 6th man…
“Ben agreed to come here knowing he would come off the bench,” the source said. “That makes it completely different than Iverson coming here … Gordon is choosing to come here and play the super sub role.” NBA.com
I don’t think Jason Kidd’s age is a concern. He’s not the scorer he used to be but he can still dish and rebound. Even at 36, he’s still a HUGE upgrade over Chris Duhon. And this is clearly a move to woo FAs in 2010. Players still want to play with Kidd. I was never a big Kidd fan – mainly because he would always beat us and trash us – but I would welcome him with open arms.
Look Sergio, regardless of how good Kidd may be, he doesn’t have more than 3 years left in him. If he does, he cannot be a full time guy. Even if he is great, we still need to find a real PG who can stick around, like Rubio. We are waiting for 2010, but there is a good chance we won’t find a PG next year because we will be focused on Lebron. If there is any year to get a legit PG, not a 37 year old, it is this year as it is a point-guard-loaded year.
Rubio is already being called the greatest player possibly ever to come out of Spain. Obiously he isn’t as good as Gasol YET, but he could be. And he is only 18. Imagine when he is 24 with 6 years of NBA experience and 10 years of pro experience. He will be amazing. He fits Dantoni’s system perfectly, and he is everything the Knicks need to become a good team. And, it just so happens that he wants to be traded to NY and he has a major contract issue that may keep him away from Minny. I don’t see how Walsh is not all over this. I know he’s contacted Kahn, but I want to see serious attempts and conversations about trying to aquire Rubio. Instead, we are trying to sign a guy who is Rubio in about 20 years.
I dont think Kidd has any impact on Rubio.
If we do get Rubio, we still need someone better to start. As good as Rubio will be.. he is not there yet.
Also, I do imagine when he is 24 with 6 years experience. And it comes after he has had his first run at Free Agency.
If he wants to come to NYC so bad, we can let him learn the NBA a little then grab him when he becomes a restricted.
First of all, of course Rubio is ready start are you serious? He’s played pro for 4 years already, including in the olympics against the world’s best. But I agree with that maybe if we get Jason Kidd, Rubio could learn a lot under him, and MAYBE wouldn’t start at first. Waiting 6 years for Rubio is too long. Having him here now would help recruit stars in 2010, and getting him and a star in 2010 would almost ensure us to at least be an above .500 team.
its not 6 years till he hits FA… its 3 for restricted… right? or is it 4… when did we draft Lee?
Rubio could start. but even though he has been a starter and all… he is 18 years old. Lebron he is not…
He would be very good now. but like in the NFL, even the best quarterbacks do well staying on the bench for a year or two. Rubio would get some playing time (this is not the NFL)… but having him be the #2 for a guy like Kidd would be HUGE in his development.
yes the kid started, but it was for spain… which is prob somewhere in between Division 1 and the NBA.
I would LOVE us to get Rubio. I would trade chandler for him without a hesitation. I also think that DW is workin hard to get him, and really cant do anything until he has the ability to trade nate. (I think Nate, Chandler and the Mobley exception gets it).
I agree. As for everyone who says Rubio will bust and he hasn’t proven anything yet obviously has never seen him play. I know that Minny doesn’t want to give him up and all these other issues, but he truly is the PERFECT fit for us at PG, and I really don’t think there is any other PG in the world who I would rather have right now in our system, because of his age, as well as talent. I think Walsh also may be looking to sign a guy like Gortat to put in the package for Rubio. Gortat or Camby would be great for Minny as they need a legit Center and someone to take some pressure of of Jefferson. I think we could take a few big contracts from Minny, even if we end up losing around 6 or 7 mill from it. We would still have enough money for Lebron. What do you think?
I am so torn on this.
I would say the perfect situation is 1 year of kidd.
Because I feel we NEED to make the playoffs this year. I think it will crush this fanbase to miss the playoffs, and have to watch our lottery pick go to utah. I mean, we never even got a player from Utah! How did they get that pick???
I also think Kidd can play 3 years. by his 3rd year, he hopefully will be letting the young PG we somehow get take over and be more of a mentor.
I also think that we need a good PG for the next couple years, and getting Kidd at a MLE will be such a steal that it may be worth it. Yes, keeping as much money as we can around for 2010 is the plan… but getting kidd would not hurt our chances at 1 star, and when such a discount is presented, it is very tough to turn it away.
I also think that Curry is gonna shock people this year and play well enough to get traded. I also think JJ will do the same (JJ could have been traded this past year). I predict they are both gone within the first 2 months of the season.
this is a tough one. I dont think he is gonna pass up the money… but hey… it would be nice to see a player want to come to NYC. Even if its Mr. Wifebeaterjerk.
What about signing and trading Kidd to Minny in a package with maybe Chandler/Harrington/Hughes. They have Flynn, but maybe a veteran like Kidd would greatly help Flynn improve and Kidd would help them become a more experienced team. What do you think about that?
why on earth would kidd do that?
He wouldn’t want to and I know Walsh wouldn’t do something like that anyway…
Do you think there is any trade that we could offer for Rubio that Minny would actually like? I’m thinking Wilson Chandler, and what about Harringon. Minny really needs scorers, and Harrington can really put points up. He can also shoot 3 pointers and is 6′9. Or what about Larry Hughes. Minny NEEDS an shooting guard. I was thinking maybe chander, harrington, and maybe a sign and trade with someone like Gortat. In return, we take Rubio and a couple of their crappy contracts.
why would gortat sign with us just to be traded to minn?
Because he would be making more money reagardless
but we can only offer him the MLE…
he could get that just by signing with minn if they really watned him.
and i dont think you can sign and trade someone from another team. you can only do that with one of your own players…
I think you guys need to move on from Ricky Rubio. He’s not coming here.
Sure, let’s have a 36 year old point guard come in and run the most uptempo offense in the league. While were at it, why don’t we have him count against the 2010 salary cap which we’ve been viciously protecting.
If he signs for one year, fine. If he doesn’t sign at all, fine. If the intent is to sign him for three years to potentially land LeBron (and it would probably be only LeBron), a player who’s game demands he dominate the ball, that takes away from Kidd’s game greatly and turns him into more of a jump shooter. He may have had a good year shooting the rock last year, but look at his recent body of work.
Honestly, if Kidd really wants a ring, there’s no reason he should want to be in New York right now.
The Knicks are completely void of veteran leadership, after trading Q and Malik… And lets face it those two didnt have stellar careers and arent even as good as Kidd and Hill now, but last year we were paying 16mil for veteran leadership, this might cost 7 to 8mil… Kidd may be running on fumes but even on fumes he’s an upgrade from Duhon… And vet leadership is priceless, ask Hill or Houston how much Dumars did for their careers early on… For years we lacked that, and had the blind leading the blind, hence you get Nate and Lee thinking they give their all because their examples are Jerome, Eddy, Steph, Francis, or Crawford…Adding either or both of these guys would be a step in the right direction from a franchise standpoint… No it wont win a championship next year but maybe down the line… When these young players we have pass on what they learned to others… It has to start somewhere, and Dan cant do it alone… No coach can… Miami won a chip with Payton and Alzono… Boston won a chip with Joe Smith veterans do play a role even at the end of their careers… And even on bad teams, our young players have to learn early how to be professional… How to take the game serious…
I’d welcome Kidd and Hill… We just need to find away to clear more cap room after that…
I understand and like your idea of veteran leadership but I just find it absolutely rediculous that we would go out and (putting Hill aside) waste money and 3 years on Kidd. Why would we bring him in? Maybe it makes us a contender next year and we can squeak in as an 8 seed but who really cares. It is tying down cap space that we so desperately have valued and have talked nothing about for the last 2 years. I think signing Kidd is a move that reminds me of Isiah days which I thought were long gone in New York. Signing old veteran washed up players does not work. It’s a move that I think sets the franchise back. I don’t understand why we are so eager to throw our MLE at Kidd while we should be trying to use it on the likes of Ramon Sessions. A young, dynamic point guard is what we need right now. Let him develop at the point in New York and he could be the key to that position for the future days of our franchise. We should not be worrying about big name stars and instead we should continue our plan of developing young talent while looking towards the better days of 2010. The next move on the horizon that I think is inevitable is trading Nate and trying to bring in some decent talent, or more favorably a 2010 first rounder which we are most likely going to lose to Utah. Going after Kidd is just not the right direction for this team.
sessions will get more then the MLE. because he is a young, dynamic point guard that many teams need right now.
The teams with cap room don’t need a PG or are going after other guys (Detroit’s used their $, Memphis used most of theirs, Portland’s after Turk or Miller, OKC has Westbrook). IF Sessions leaves Mill, it’ll be for the MLE.
hey GBAKED!howz this? since the BUCKS,JUST lost CHARLIE .V ,and they dont have a PF(except aging KURT THOMAS) what if we did a sign and trade DAVID LEE for RAMON SESSIONS is it do able?
Lee has more value than sessions and there contracts would not match up. I don’t think sessions is worth much more than an MLE personally. I think prob around 6.5-7 a year at the very max, but in this economy, I’m not so sure. And Bruno’s right, most teams don’t need a point and if they did, they drafted one due to the abundance of points in this year’s draft.
Thats a good trade cant argue with that might have to take back Elson to make is work, but maybe we get Joe Alevander instead… They have Jennings and Ridnour, they dont need Sessions
But adding a veteran point whether it be Nash or Kidd was always the plan… There would be no deviation, and if Nash stays then he isnt much of an option… You say making the 8th seed doesnt matter, but it will if we give up a lottery pick next year to Utah… And how many years can the Knicks sustain being bad, being under 500… Look at Philly and Atl, they benefitted from a playoff run in 08 and were better in 09… Sessions is good but also very young and doesnt provide vet leadership at all… And with two rookies, a 1year player, a 2 year player, Curry and Darko you need veterans bad, real bad…
Does anyone truly think that bringing in Jason Kidd this year is magically going to win us a championship? Of course it won’t. And after this year, who knows if Kidd even has another year. If he does, he won’t be able to play as much anyway and do the things that once made him a legend.
I definitely want Kidd. I think he has at least 2 more good years left in him and havin ghim on our roster will be beneficial in trying to sign Lebron. Many of you are correct in saying we won’t win a championship this year, but next year with Kidd, Lebron, and Bosh, we will.
Anyone who watched the Knicks last year knows they needed three things badly , Shotblocking, Veteran Leadership, and an Upgrade at the point… And If we add Hill and Kidd, along with Jordan, Darko, and Douglas we would have already accomplished all three… While only trading Q… Which means we still have the assets to make other moves… This is only the beginning…
And what happens in 2 years when Hill and Kidd are died out and can’t play anymore and we still haven’t won a championship? It’s better to take a risk with a higher possible reward, like getting Rubio, then going to safe way, which the chances of reward are slimmer. Kidd will not have enough left in him by the time we are ready to win a championship.
2 years when hill and kidd are died out?
we know you want rubio. but getting kidd does not change the fact that he was drafted by Minn, who is getting a bunch of offers for him.
in no way does us getting kidd prevent us from getting rubio.
I know, but putting Rubio aside, do you honestly see Kidd winning us a championship? Truthefully. And if we were to get Kidd AND another young PG then I would be happy. Having the young PG gives us time to improve, and I agree that Kidd would help him improve. But getting Kidd alone means that Duhon and Kidd will be our PG’s, and Duhon is not our future anyway, so getting Kidd would be a waste. You see what I’m saying?
duhon is gone after this year.
he isnt in the future plans.
We wouldnt have traded anything that would prevent us from getting Rubio… That could still happen…
Why are we talking about championship when we havent been to the playoffs in what 5years… Come on, lets be real… The Knicks cant bring anyone in FA this year that will win us a chip… Cut the chip talk out, we need to make the 1st step and make the playoffs… The assumption is the Knicks will offer 3yrs but we dont know that its speculation… They may offer 2 with a team option for 3… Or just 1… And Hill will be a 1yr deal for sure…
Perfectly put.
no it isnt by bringing in Hill and Kidd your throwing valuable money down the tubes long term and I just don’t want that
but kidd at a MLE is a STEAL!!!!!
if he wants to take a NYC discount, you deviate a little. because otherwise you are paying lots more to someone and it hurts you more later.
I think the Hill thing is smoke… this is a discussion about kidd until Hill comes in to meet with the team.
We’re not bringing in Hill; get over it. We have chandler adn gallinari, plus harrington could even play the 3. He’s useless.
I don’t think Kidd is coming anymore hes trynna hustle Marc Cuban
Reports say the Raptors are gonna go after Lee Walsh should S&T for Bosh, maybe Lee, Harrington, Nate for Bosh If we get Bosh we can make the Playoffs and stick Utah with a late first rounder.
No way. Giving those 3 players for Bosh would not be worth it. We don’t need a PF right now, and we wouldn’t trade for Bosh, we would at least wait until 2010. But we just got Jordan Hill, and it would be a waste for him to sit on the bench.
I would do harrington, chandler, and nate for amare personally. Lee, although undersized, could still play center and amare would play the 4. I might be the only one in the forum saying this, but i feel like phoenix would actually like the trade as nash might opt out and barbosa isnt a natural guard. So Nate could start the point. Chandler, at this point is an upgrade to earl clark, and harrington could put up similar numbers in regards to ppg that amare does.
We need to hustle the Kings out of there pick next year Lance Stephenson, Willie Warren, John Wall, Greg Monroe each one is VERY Talented.
Yes, but easier said then done.
Nate? And I left out Derrick Favors, Aminu, and Alabi
Certainly not Nate alone…
And Kemba Walker. That kid will explode next year. Scotty Reynolds too. Maybe Harangody will add some more skills to his set.
The way I see it we don’t need Lee let him walk.
Guys Jason Kidd isn’t a top 10 guard in the league. The Knicks run an uptempo system and need a point guard that can make shots. Kidd can only hit jump shots if no one is anywhere near him. He is not the answer. Not even close to the answer. And if they were to get him anything more than a year gauranteed is crazy
Name 10 better.
Paul
D.Williams
Nash
Parker
Mo Williams?
Rondo?
J.Nelson?
Kidd is still top 10 if not top 5 anymore.
Eh, it’s arguable. Going by stats, he’s not top 10 in the league anymore. In regards to what he brings at the point and how he makes his team better, he definitely is top 10. So I guess it depends on what’s valued more. If you want a guy who will put up 15 points a game and 7-8 assists a game, well, kidd will give you the assists, but not the points. If you want a leader, he’ll lead his team better than everyone with the exception of paul, d. williams, nash and then some can argue for tony and rondo. Then again, tony and rondo are on teams where others are leaders as well due to stacked lineups.
MO WILLIAMS.
ARGGGGG.
Why is everyone riding Mo Williams now? He was nothing before Lebron so how is he top 10 all of a sudden. He is doing the same thing in with the Bucks and now e is with Lebron he is top 10….WTF
Kidd doesn’t have the legs to run D’antoni’s system. He’s also one of the worst defenders in the league now. He gets burned by anyone under 30.
And Basketball 101: If you lose your legs then you lose your shot (Ask Duhon.) With not shot and no defense I don’t see how signing Kidd to multiple years will help us at all.
Slow day….
Tommy ,
Alan Hahn had a chat and said the Rubio talk is done, drop it, fuggedaboudit he wont be a Knick why do you still think hes in play?
kidd would be a huge upgrade over duhon…obviously. age should not be a big factor because he has not shown signs of breaking down… nor has he been injured. kidd is tailor made for ssol. if you remember when he was in his prime, the nets played a run and gun system which made them an eastern conference powerhouse for 3 years. not only will this system inflate his stats (the mavs play a slow down half court offense), but he will quicken the development of gallo, chandler, and hill. i’d rather give the mle to kidd, rather than ramon sessions.
The Main Reason I want Kidd is for his Leadership something our starters haven’t had in for ever.
Some of the comments in here made me laugh big time. Everybody is complaining about kidd and saying that they don’t want him. But the truth is that kidd is a pass first point guard who makes everyone around him better. So what he’s getting older in age, he’s still in great shape and his passing won’t diminish in time. David Lee had a breakout year this year and duhon was partially responsible for that due to the pick and roll. Imagine what kidd could do if we retained lee. Just the fact that kidd can find the open better than 90% of the guards in the league is very intriguing. In regards to defense, he averaged 2 steals a game last year. Now in regards to the fact that dallas will probably offer him in the low 20’s and we can only offer about 18 mil over three years, at this point in his career, at 36, I feel like Kidd will come to NY, so that he can go home to his kids every night. I mean honestly, the guy has made enough in his career and having the ability to spend time with them 365 days a year has to be more valuable to him than 1-2 mil a year. The fact is that I would rather make a push for someone like rubio than to sign kidd, but I would be perfectly content with kidd running the point and helping our young players develop.
biggie or others with a better understanding of our cap situation…
if we sign kidd to the MLE for 3 years (most it will be)… and add lee for 8 per…
what does that do to the 2010 plans as it stands now?
It’s only an MLE. It’s 6 mil a year. First off, it most likely doesn’t interfere with our cap considering that donnie would have exercised that on a veteran anyways. But with that aside, we could make that money back for this year by shedding JJ’s contract alone. It doesn’t make that big of a deal. In regards to Lee’s 8 mil, we still should have the ability to make a push a lebron and another good player. Not sure about two “superstars”, but then again, we can package lee for someone like bosh or amare and still be able to push for lebron next year.
Yup. We can S&T for a Max Player next year with Lee if need be, Curry will be an expiring, and JJ will be one yr shorter. Shouldn’t be a problem really. Kidd even at 3yrs doesn’t affect our long term plans at all.
Yea and that is with Curry imagine if we move him this offseason…
Assuming we sign Lee for 8 and Kidd for 6 and sign both our 1st rounders this year and nothg else but roster filler for the next year it leaves us with about 14 mil under the cap in 2010/11
not enough for Lebron for sure.,
Ok, then if walsh trade jj’s 6 mil salary, and eddy’s 10 mil a year salary, that already leave’s an additional 16 mil or 30 mil. Kobe makes 21 a yaer, so say lebron wanted 22, just to for example purposes, we can still get a good player for 8 mil a year. Will he be a superstar? No. But if we had lebron, j.kidd, gallinari, d-lee, wilson, j. hill, ghostface, and another good player, say a 2-guard, someone like a randy foye (he’s not a “good” player yet, but he may be by next year as he’s getting better by year), then i’d be overly content…not to mention that we could probably shop chandler and future picks to nab a first rounder to groom under kidd.
you’re right. the execution of the plan (assuming we take on the extra 14 mil of Lee/Kidd) depends on finding a taker for Curry and Jeffries for expiring contracts. So that money actually comes OFF the books rather than is folded into new salaries
That’s why the T Mac deal looks so promising as it saves us Curry’s nut in 2010/11
Which would put us back on track to having $$ to spend in Lebron.
it appears then…
that no matter what, trading EC and JJ are the two biggest things for DW to do this year.
cause even if we dont sign kidd… we are prob gonna sign someone to a MLE so we can field a competitive team.
hopefully we can save a mill or two on lee…
I would think the Onus is on D’Antoni and his “system” to make us competitive in 2009/10.
If we can add some cheap athletes (Ewing Jr et al) and have a good young point (cheap) guard like Rubio we can ACTUALLY run the Seven Seconds or Less Offense and make some waves without spending big coin on any one slot.
Last year Coach D gave up on the 7SOL because he didnt have the horses to run it the way he wanted.
I dont think spending on the MLE EVER makes a big difference.
Like I saiud above (and will modify a bit) the Onus should be on Donnie to find cheap players who can fit the D’Antoni system that we are paying 8 mil a year for (isnt the D’Antoni’s salary?).
If we are going to buy into Coach D as the driver of this bus Walsh HAS TO get horse in so D’Antoni can play the offense that he is known for.
Im thinking a hybrid of what Pitino ran in the early days of the Knicks where there is some helter skelter fuill court presses and run run run at every opportunity.
you dont necessarily need expensive players for that but a whole bunch of athletes.
BIGGIE SMALLS! you know about cap space right? what about a sign and trade between the KNICKS and the BUCKS ..DAVID LEE for RAMON SESSIONS both are restricteds,bucks just lost their PF (CHARLIE V)they only have KURT THOMAS as a PF WHADDYA THINK?
well you have to get Lee to agree to go to Milwaukee.
Maybe 12 mil a year will persuade him.
Assuming Sessions will get 8 mil a year you’ve got to make up 4 mil in salary coming back to NYC.
Maybe Bruce Bowen? That works under the cap.. not sure if they bite. Bowen give vet leadership and expires in 2010 anyway.
By the way, I still don’t know why we aren’t pursuing nash at all. Everyone knows that he wants to come here and would be great here. I feel like the guy would be remotely “heartbroken” if we got kidd and didn’t even make an attempt to go after him.
For this next year alone, not based on age or anything, there are alot of point guards better than Kidd.
1. paul 2. williams 3. nash 4. rondo 5. devin harris 6. chauncey 7. derrick rose 8. tony parker 9. jameer nelson… and for this system you would want baron davis over jason kidd
Forgot about Rose and Billups, I’ll give you those 2. But Davis over Kidd? Pass what you’re smokin this way……
I love how nash in number 3 when he does that same exact thing that kidd does, except he’s a better shooter. Not to mention that nash had to put up 15 shots a game b/c amare was hurt and his talent, besides shaq, was limited to j-rich and barbosa, while kidd put up only 11 shots because he didn’t need to put up that many with j-howard, terry, and nowitzki there. My point is that if nash is #3 in your eyes, there’s no way that kidd can’t be top 5. And no, you wouldn’t want baron davis, a injury prone, shoot first, pass second guard in here with a ridiculous salary.
By the way, they’re are a lot of hypocrites in this thread as well…some are saying how we need rubio and kidd can’t shoot, but last time I checked, rubio has the worst jumpshot of any guard in the draft. Then they say (although this isn’t hypocritical), that we NEED rubio and that kidd won’t do anything for us, but let me as you something. First off, Rubio’s played against subpar competition, so how do you know that he’s going to be good? Second off, what’s so bad about keeping Kidd for three years and trading for a lottery for a first rounder next year, a really strong draft, where we can get a point? Then we can groom him under kidd in the 2010-11 season and he can eventually replace kidd in the 2011-12 season, leading to kidd retiring there after. Is that SO bad?
Wo, bad english. I meant trading for a lottery pick or even just a first rounder, next year.
There’s a huge difference. Kidd is literally TWICE Rubio’s age. There’s nothing hypocritical about it.
No, i’m saying it’s hypocritical for people to want rubio and say that kidd can’t shoot, because rubio can’t shoot. Will rubio develop a shot? Yes. But at this point, he still doesn’t have one, so to say that we need a point that can shoot and that we should take rubio, well, that’s ridiculous. And my other point is that getting a first round pg next year or the year after to groom under kidd would not be a bad thing.
Not ridiculous at all. One has a shot in the future, the other has NO future.
Ok, one has no guidance and will need a lot of time to develop, which will lead to the knicks not making 500 for a year or two, which will not entice LBJ at all. The other offers a veteran presence, can help develop young players, and although not extremely enticing, is definitely more enticing then having the biggest name on the team being david lee.
Are you insisting that an over-the-hill 36 y/o PG is more enticing than the top PG in the last draft? Lebron will see Kidd and see a washed up PG who couldn’t get it done with great teams in his prime, much less 10 years after the fact. I know it’s an opinion but you’re DEAD wrong here.
Yes I am. The reason is that kidd is washed up, yes, but honestly, he’s still a big name and makes others around him better. This year, we would have a better record with kidd than rubio. Rubio would need two-three years to develop into a good player. I’m pretty sure LBJ would rather come to a team that had a veteran leader than a rebuilding project that’s leader in the locker room was d-lee.
A Vet leader doesn’t mean anything if he doesn’t have a promising understudy. Case in point, how many times did JJ fricken Barea cover Kidds ass? Too many.
Also Kidd plays NO Defense and can no longer run an all out Seven Seconds or less offense.
Not even sure if he can do it on a part time basis.
At this point in his career he should be in a slow down half court game. He is NOT the same player as his Nets days in a lot of ways..
Enough with the waiting already…knicks fans have been waiting for 8 years just to get back in the playoffs! 2010 has to be it. By the end of next summer the knicks need to be ready to make it at least to the playoffs. But that all starts with getting a real PG. Sure Kidd could be a good mentor or w/e and as a 1 or 2 year deal, fine. But he isn’t the future and we all know that, but why must we keep on waiting for a PG. Getting a legit PG will help us attract the stars in 2010 because who wants to come to a team with no quarterback.
Jason Kidd isn’t the kind of guy to attract someone like LBJ. The 2010 FA’s will want to see that progress forward has been made. That doesn’t mean a 36 year old rental. I think that Kidd thing is becoming a much bigger deal than it should be.
Nobody is expecting him to be the future anyway, so whether we get him or not will not effect any of our long term plans, and we would basically be staying the same. If the FA’s don’t want to come here NOW, they will feel the same regardless of Kidd being here or not.
The only way I see this changing is if we make the playoffs this year, which will be a long shot. Whether Kidd comes or not, we still need to be searching for our future PG.
Wait, so J-Kidd won’t entice LBJ, but a rookie that needs time to develop will? Give me a break. You’re telling me that a team who had names like rubio (assuming we can get him), gallinari, jordan hill, and david lee is going to entice lebron? Are you serious? Next year isn’t the “we have to win this year or else donnie failed” year. Next year is about enticing lebron so that we can restore the dynasty that we once had. Kidd is a leader on and off the court and we need some veteran presence, something that every winning team in the league has, in order to win.
I really have no idea what world you’re living in. All those names you mentioned are VERY enticing because they encompass youth. Youth and potential for a Dynasty is WAY more enticing to Lebron than J-Kidd, who got knocked out of the second round in 5 games with Dirk, J-Howard and J-Terry on his team.
Did you even watch this season? Kidd couldn’t guard anyone in the man-to-man. He has no lateral quickness and can’t guard the perimeter. No way Kidd lasts more than 20-25 mins in MD’s system. His legs are GONE.
What world are you in? Why would Lebron want to go to a rebuilding project when he can stay in cleveland and be competitive every year? That team would need two years to be a 500 team and Lebron would know that. Names will entice LBJ, not a team who’s biggest name is david lee.
I never he would choose Knicks over Cleveland, but he would choose a team with a future over “names.” If you think Kidd is still and elite name then you need to get your head out of 2002.
Read my comment that I posted towards the bottom, so that you understand what i’m talking about.
Sessions!! Thats who we need to get bottom line!!
Young and getting better with all the skill sets that MD needs to mold the PG he needs. After that S & T Lee and Nate now that they see the market is not there for the money they want and send them along with Harrington to the kings for Kevin Martin and a first RD pick.
If that gets done take a shot at a trade for T-mac giving Curry Huges & Mobley in return.
Sessions,Martin,T-mac,Hill,Darko now that is a team to be excited about!!
HAHAHAHA, wait wait, nate and harrington for kevin martin and a first rounder? What are you smoking. Besides the fact that salary wise, the kings can’t do that, why would they give up there best player, who’s better than nate and better than harrington plus a first rounder that’s bound to be a top 10 pick next year and they even though that? Plus, t-mac for curry, hughes, and mobley doesn’t work out financially at all, either.
How did you come up with the money not matching?? First of all I said Lee Nate and Harrington for Martin, if we need to throw in a little more like say Douglas fine im just giving a framework for a deal. Yea he is there best player at the moment but they have nothing else and they just drafted evens who can replace him. so rather then one very good player they can have 3 good players to give there team balance and bottom line Lee and Nate if they can get people in the Garden they damn sure can help get fans back in the kings arena!! Nate,Evens,Harrington,Lee and Hawes is a much more balanced and exciting team then K.Martin and nothing else!! and for the record replacing Harrington with Chandler or Gallo is fine but the trade can be done because the kings have nothing going!!
oh and Martin makes over 11 mill this year and it go’s up from there and if we get Lee and Nate for what the market seems to be pricing them its almost a push plus there under the cap by plenty and balance at position rather then one very good player is much more important, add to that having a top 10 in jersey selling player is good for there pockets!!
My bad b/c i didn’t see lee, but that aside, harrington makes 9.2, lee is going to make about 8 a year, nate’s going to command about 6 a year and kmart makes 8.7 a yaer, so the money does not match up at all. They have nothign else? They have a young team with jason thompson and spencer hawes, so harrington/lee is not that needed. Nate would be a nice addition, but evans can run the point with k-mart, so nates not needed to the fullest extent. That top 10 pick next year will yield them a player with a lot higher of a ceiling than nate/harrington/Lee can offer. So in reality, they are trading a future starter and a very good player for a good player and two “overly decent” players, one which will be gone next year (harrington). And if they get nate, they don’t need ghostface. The fact is that the trade doesn’t work financially and doesn’t improve them much. They are building aroudn youth and they are going to stay that way.
K.Martin is making 10mill plus this year and it grows from there, and you make a fair point they can keep the pick if need be the point is Martin more then anything. Thompson?? Lee would start over him in a heartbeat! have u seen the scouting reports on him of late? but bring him in behind Lee gives them depth which makes having Lee that much better. Nate sells tickets and jerseys and the malofs would love that with out breaking the bank! A Nate & Evans back court with a Lee & Hawes front court is a young and exciting way to go for them and in the end a Sessions & Martin back court for the Knicks would do the same for us.
T-mac 23mill this year Curry & Huges together are 23 mill this year…so it does not work out how barnaby?
Cuttino’s contract would put it over. Hughes and Curry for T-mac would work though. And yes, Lee is an upgrade to thompson, but my point is that thompson still has just as high if not a higher ceiling than lee, so lee is just overkill basiaclly. And nate isn’t as exciting in a half-court system.
It would not be overkill to have to young talented forwards if anything its a blessing to have that kind of depth at that spot as well as balancing out the rest of your line up in one shot!
Nate is exciting anywhere he go’s!! That my friend is a fact and having him and Evens in a back court together would be dynamic. In the end the NBA is a biz and its about making money and the kings are a dead team with no buzz factor what so ever, this will give it to them and Nate in the end makes more money for a team then anybody else in this trade I have come up with. That is why I see it as something that can get done.
This Rubio hype is over the top!! we have not seen more then 5 mins of footage on this kid and everybody is making him a world beater….Sessions has earned his time and has done it on every level here in this country and more important he has done it on a high level in the NBA.
You mean YOU haven’t seen more than 5 mins of footage.
That said I would be ecstatic with either Rubio or Sessions.
Sessions is a solid player that would be a great addition to this team. Jason Kidd whined his way out of NJ and got traded for a PG who is better than him. The Mavericks would have been a better team not making that trade
“The Minnesota Timberwolves’ top draft pick, Ricky Rubio, 18, will remain in Spain to play for his DKV Joventut basketball team for the remaining two years of his contract rather than try to move to the NBA this season, El Periodico reported today.”
“The Barcelona newspaper also says Rubio, who was paid $97,000 last season, plans to withdraw his contract lawsuit against DKV Joventut.”
Good, that’s done with. That’s what Minny gets in the first place, but now we can jump off of the rubio bandwagon at least.
IF that’s legitimate. First time I’m hearing it’s official. It seems too early for Rubio to make his decision already…we’ll see soon.
Sounds fishy.
He can easily go play for Real Madrid which has a ton of money and is in the Euro “big leagues”
DKV is having money problems and will be in the lower Euro league this year based on their performance last year
Why would he play in a lower league for 100 grand when an upper league team will pay him more AND cover his DKV buy out?
I think talks have to be on going on a number of levels.
2 comments.
1) i think we all get the fact that about 9 outta 10 people on this blog really really want rubio, but he was drafted 3 spots ahead of the knicks and minny says they arent trading him. the knicks are publicly asking about him thats all a rubio fan can hope for. please stop talking about him like the knicks can go out an get him easily. this reminds me of the manny posts on metsblog..only as bad as that was, manny was atleast a free agent.
2) as for top point guards Rondo…really? i realize this is a what have you done for me lately league and rondo really stepped up his game in the playoffs yet he averaged 11pts 8 assists an 5 boards for the season on a team with pierce allen and garnett…is that really top 4 pgs? do people really think that hes better then billups parker nelson kidd nash harris arenas iverson bibby davis rose miller heck even marbury for that matter
Marbury, yes. Iverson isn’t a 1, otherwise you’re spot on. I like Rondo, and would LOVE him on the Knicks, but he’s not that good yet.
yea me too, im not bashing rondo before anyone gets the wrong impression he is a very talented young point guard i’m just saying i feel he was getting way overrated esp on the blog today due to the team around him and his playoff stats. i’ve seen him play quite alot and think he will be great…just not yet. and that fake behind the pass is a travel/carry/something illegal
Check this out, Hoospworld is wondering what exactly is the Knicks plan??
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13159
You really put Kidd, Bibby, and Marbury over Rondo?
i was stretching at the end….i think if marbury or bibby started on that team they could put up comprable stats but thats my opinion so no….
if we are talking right now, not long term then yes id take kidd over rondo…a few years down the road then no, but this past season and this upcoming season i would
Jason Kidd is gunna come on as a teacher with lots of playoff experience he can shed on us. if we get to the secound round of the playoffs. (like the bulls almost did) we can say hello to a big time talent because they dont want to come to a none playoff worthy team.
According to ESPN….
An executive with knowledge of David Lee’s trade talks with the Memphis Grizzlies tells 1050 ESPN New York’s Andrew Marchand, Lee’s agent asked for $60 million over five years. Memphis was prepared to offer Lee $40 million over five years. But when they heard the initial asking price, they decided to trade instead for ex-Knick Zach Randolph. Lee’s agent, Mark Bartelstein, could not immediately reached for comment.
Guys, here’s my point. LBJ want’s to go to a team that has shown signs of progression and has a winning mentality. My point is that if we got rubio, we would progress, yes, but we wouldn’t be winning because we would need time for him to develop. With that said, although kidd has never been on a championship team (as far as i remember?), he still has been on winning teams and makes others around him better. My point is that Kidd is more enticing to lebron because he offers a veteran presence and makes everyone around him better; leading to a better team. Kidd could potentially turn d-lee into an all-star this year and help the youth along, which would show a lot of promise to lebron. Rubio, at 18, most likely would not make others around him significantly better, up to the point that LBJ would want to come here. We would most likely come across as a rebuilding project, so LBJ would recognize this and most likely stay in cleveland. With that said, we could take kidd and trade for a draft pick next year to develop under kidd. To me, this is a better scenario than taking on rubio, especially since his best mentor at the point in NY would be chris duhon. That’s my point. Would I prefer Rubio to run the point? Obviously. But I think that Kidd is a better scenario for us at this point and LBJ would feel more comfortable by a team ran by J-Kidd as opposed to Rubio.
We get kidd AND rubio and then we can still be good and rubio will improve. I think LBJ would want to see more that we can be a very good team and he knows that him coming would make us a great team anyway. He knows kidd would only be there a couple of years, so he would want to see that there is a real future, which starts with having a real pg.
Guys we really need to make noise about Sessions!! Rubio would be ok but we can get Sessions right now!! So we need to get a buzz out there as Knick fans that we want him!! if we can get Rubio down the line then fine but we need to lock Sessions up NOW!!
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