|
|
|
Yahoo is reporting that the Grant Hill is going to re-sign with the Suns.
This might be a blessing in disguise. Hill for the bi-annual exception was one thing, but $5 million for him would have been another. And if 
hte report was true about the potential three year deal, then that would have been a bit questionable. Walsh now still has both his bi-annual and his MLE to play around with. Just this week, the Bulls signed Jannero Pargo for their bi-annual exception, so there are good players out there that can be had for that kind of price. Let’s call a spade a spade here, $5 million for Grant Hill would have been overpaying.
More importantly, Hill is apparently staying in large part because Steve Nash is nearing a 3 year, $33 million contract extension.
Ouch. This one stings a bit more. If this happens, then forget about the idea of Nash coming here next summer. Forget also about the idea of him coming to the Knicks this summer in a trade. Nash would have been nice, but he is the face of that Phoenix franchise. However, I get the impression that the Knicks will be playing in a NBA Finals sooner than the Suns will. Nash deciding to end his career there is a nice gesture, but I do not think that team is going anywhere.
Yahoo is also reporting that the Suns have signed Channing Frye to a 2 year, $3.8 million deal, or for the bi-annual exception. The second year is at Frye’s option.
Good move for Frye. He might have a chance to start at center alongside Amare. If he can get 25 mpg, he can put up some decent numbers and get a better contract next summer. I am a believer in Frye talent. He had a great rookie year for the Knicks.
Also, it appears that the Suns are going to keep Amare, according to the Arizona Republic.
All in all, the biggest news here is the extension for Steve Nash. Grant Hill would have been a starter here, but he was an awkward fit for obvious reasons. He plays the same position as our two young studs (Wilson Chandler and Danilo Gallinari) and he is on the wrong side of 35 years old. Jason Kidd was a completely different situation. Kidd would have filled a major hole on our team and would have been our starting PG playing 30+ mpg for the next three seasons. Hill would have been a veteran presence and a role player.
But with Nash’s extension, Donnie Walsh will have to think long and hard about his backup options. The Rubio situation is not looking great at this point. I am not saying it will not happen, but I am just not sure if it will. The Knicks have Chris Duhon for next season, but I would be shocked if they offered him another $6 million next summer to stay here (unless he has a monster season this year). Walsh signed him to a 2 year deal for a reason. Even if Rubio was on the Knicks, would we be able to assume that he can be a major factor within the next two seasons?
Andre Miller is not going to happen. He is not going to lower his asking price to the MLE to come here. Travis Outlaw and Steve Blake is a good package for Miller if the Sixers decide to take it. The Knicks have nothing like that to offer. Chris Duhon would be a decent start, but there is not much else for us to offer. Miller would be a great addition, but it is unlikely. If he decided to to take the MLE, that would be fantastic.
Ramon Sessions and Ray Felton are still out there, but I doubt that their respective teams let go of either one of them.
The report of Jeffries for Mike James would be a good deal to ditch salary and to bring in some depth at PG. James is a nice offensive PG that can spell Duhon and at times play next to Duhon. But he would be a one year stop gap player. He would simply play out the season along with Duhon and then we would have to start from scratch next summer. That is not an ideal solution, but it is better than nothing.
Luke Ridnour can be a decent pickup if Ramon Sessions stays in Milwaukee. He has good passing ability and can push in transition. However, he is not a good defender, and like Mike James, he would be a band-aid solution.
I am not really sure where to go from there. Having dealt Sergio Rodriguez, it appears that the Blazers will keep Jerryd Bayless. I have called for Jordan Farmar, who I think has some good talent and has the attitude to succeed in NY. Perhaps the controlled offensive scheme of Phil Jackson is not well-suited for Farmar.
CJ Watson is a free agent and can probably be had for peanuts. I like the way he pushed the ball up the floor, a trait that is extremely important for this team. Watch Chris Duhon after the opposing team scores a basket. He has the ball up the floor before the other team even has a chance to set up their defense. That allows for a quick shot, hence the “7 seconds or less offense”. Watson can push the ball well.
There are likely to be some retreads with talent available, but while a band-aid solution will help for next season, ideally we can find a PG that will be under contract for next summer.
We were just discussing this in the eddy curry weight loss thread Chris. More and more it looks like we are going into next season with our team as-is or with minimal upgrades. If that holds true, I can’t see us making the playoffs nor can I see Lebron having serious interest in coming here.
does anyone know what plan D is?
Bringing Allan Houston out of retirement for a “veteran presence who plays defense”….
allan houston never played dee
In his prime, he was still a better defender than just about everyone on the team right now. Granted, he has no knees anymore and it was a joke.
Why don’t the Knicks focus a little more on what they can obtain through the draft (like the T-wolves) and worry a little less about filling the roster full of guys from other teams. It’s a sad day when someone writes an article sad about the fact that 2 38 year olds don’t want to come to New York. Even if they have gas in the tank, it will only be for a year or 2, then you have to pay them during their decline. Get young guys entering their prime while they are cheap now rather than sit back and hope guys want to play in NY
“it’s a sad day”
take a relax pill, bud…
DONNIE WALSH is like the “BIZZARRO ZEKE” we just keep on doing nothing as fast as we can .i bet if you walk into the offices of MSG,You can hear CRICKETS. next year ,why would any big name free agents sign with THIS team.? there is nobody of consequence on it.if this is the team we put out on the floor this year(minus LEE & ROBINSON) We wont win 29 games,we will be in the lottery again,except we wont have a first round pick.Has anyone checked MR.WALSH’s pulse lately to see if hes still breathing? im gettin nervous,real nervous
WHAT WAS THAT? oh! i thought i heard faint chants of “bring back isaiah”
Man you are like the most negative person I have seen in a while relax if you want isaiah back your losing your mind. While hill would have been an ok add it’s not something I’m going to lose sleep over and even if we don’t get lebron next year we will have flexibility to make moves. you need to relax ok, We are a better franchise then we were a year ago for the simple fact it’s not a circus in MSG anymore.
FIRST OF ALL the zeke thing was a joke, and everyone is so optimistic on this site,that you need the negativity.but can somebody finally tell me why everyone is so blindly following DONNIE WALSH? im not being insulting,but i really want to know what he has done to make everyone think ,that when he does nothing ,its such a great move.besides reggie miller ,what has he done in the past that makes eveyone on this site DRINK HIS KOOL-AID? I SWEAR,and ive lived in ny my whole life,ive never seen this before.people are acting as if JESUS CHRIST took over the knicks and we as fans cant even question this guy.smack yourselves in faCE WITH SOME COLD WATER AND SNAP OUT OF IT!!! its kinda lookin like the stepford wives.nothing i say or you say is gonna make a difference anyway,
I completely agree with you Bob.
You are a joke bob… When Donnie took the job, he made a goal to be under the cap by 2010. Everyone said it couldn’t be done. He unloaded our two most unloadable contracts in one day for pieces that come off the books before 2010. The only way we can get better was to take out the trash and start again. Donnie has done that and some. We are in a position now to take advantage of a slow market for FA’s. The players that didn’t sign early will see their value decline when all of the options start to dry up and we will sign a player for under market value. That is the only smart course of action- although I wouldn’t expect for you to be able to figure that out on your own bob. There is no blind following- Donnie walsh is the man for the job
that is THE definition of blind following
@kid tarheel, i ask a legit question,and you come up with cheap insults? you dont know me ! its like i said, just question DONNIE WALSH, and you act as if i insulted your wife. “i wouldnt expect you to figure that out on your own” ? like i said you dont even know who i am, just keep patting yourself on the back PRICK
all anyone knows about you bob is what you post on this site.
that, in view of most here, is more then enough to make the assumption that you can not figure it out on your own.
why are people trusting DW on this?
well, he has yet to do anything to lose that trust… yes, it would have been nice to get a pg in the draft… but minn and golden state screwed us outta that… and in hindsight, trading for the 5 pick would have been nice… but hindsight is always 20/20 and i wont kill the guy for strike 1.
some people can get on him for not drafting jennings… i hated that kids attitude, so I am happy he passed… but again… that will turn into a hindsight thing.
he has done a very good job clearing our cap space. brought in a coach many of us like. completely changed the attitude of the front office to that of a respectable organization. has been nothing short of perfect with the media.
your attitude is the exact reason people say that you cant rebuild in NY. because of the fan that refuses to let people do their jobs.
he has made efforts to sign 2 players he wanted, neither of which worked out. now he will try for some other things.
as someone stating earlier… chill out dude.
i am negative on this site because someone has to be.everyone cannot agree with everything.negativity is NOT my attitude,but as i said before,one of us has to not drink the kool-aid.do you think that DUHON was a good sign?ROBERSON?not trading for washingtons 5?not trading NATE AND JJ when he had the chance last year? see even i thought of those things and im not as smart as you guys.
Random comment, but I feel like if we have money left over to spend, we might want to take a small portion and get gerald green. Although he hasn’t done much in his career up to date, last year he averaged 5.2 points a game in under 10 minutes a game. Turn that 10 minutes into 25 a game in our system, he may be able to be a nice role player who can put up 12-15 points a game for us. Plus, he’s still only 23 and still developing…
Not a bad idea. That is the type of thinking that can work out for a team like us. He would likely sign for the minimum. I like that idea, especially if Almond doesn’t work out.
We really need to deal a couple of our forwards to get Rubio. We need to sign and trade David Lee for a SG like Rudy Fernandez who would fit in the T-Wolves system and then package him with Wilson or Harrington for Rubio. I could not care less about losing David Lee now that we have Jordan Hill. Hill is capable of doing anything Lee did offensively and can probably play better defense. He is also a strong rebounder. We have ample forwards but no PG. We should work VERY hard on trying to deal D Lee to get pieces for Rubio. Fernandez would be ideal.
LOL, Hill is not capable of doing what lee did offensively for at least two years. And a team with rubio, gallinari, and jordan hill leading the way is not the answer. Considering that all three need time to develop and if gallinari got hurt, we would have nobody capable of scoring over 15 points a game. And thats assuming that gallinari has that capability this year.
How can’t Jordan Hill do what D Lee did offensively? I know he’s young and raw, but David Lee really does not have much offensive talent. Jordan Hill has a better jump shot than David Lee and he can run the same. Lee got most of his points off dunks and easy buckets because of the running system. Jordan Hill can run also so he can do all those things also.
Jordan’s not grabbing 3 rebounds a game and he can’t penetrate/create like Lee can. And Lee has a better jumper than Hill. He developed it nicely last year. I don’t see how Hill can shoot nearly 55% from the field like Lee, dunk or no dunks.
*three offensive rebounds
You must mean Jordan Farmar Hill is a beast.
LOL are you serious, you can’t be serious Lee does nothing but get garbage points and dunks off PNR he has NO post move NO go to move and he has NO jumpshot hes a good rebounder on a team where no one else rebounds and he defense is atrocious.
Hill is 6′10″ and is a better shooter better post player MUCH better defender and just as good as a rebounder, and he crashes the offensive glass for putbacks not just another rebound.
HAHAHAHAHA. Just HAHAHAHHAHAHA. That’s why hill dropped so far down the draft board. Just stop.
far down?didnt we get him with the 8th?
He was originally projected top 4 though…that’s a big drop in such a weak draft class.
You seem to not recall that Lee was the 31pick in the draft.
30th but with that aside it was a much stronger draft class and nobody thought that lee would turn out hte way he did. With that said, you can say the same about hill and I’m not saying Hill will be bad because I do like him, but he still, at this point is nowhere near d-lee’s offensive abilities. Chris agreed with me. With that said, he could easily be better than lee but he needs time is all i’m saying.
Lee has no offensive ability come on!! his two moves Dunk and Layup thats it nothing else and Brook Lopez fell to 10 last year and hes one of the best big men in the league and last years draft wasn’t considered weak.
Donnie and Mike said J Hill shot the Three ball pretty good in the workout…..If that means anything.
How can you say that David Lee’s jump shot is better than Hill’s. Lee’s shot is hideous and he can only hit it if he’s WIDE open. Hill as somewhat of a legit mid range game, like Ama’re, but OBVIOUSLY not as good. Hill also has better size and athleticism for the 4 spot than D Lee does.
I’ll give you size and athleticism, but at this point, Hill’s jumper is not as good as D-Lee’s. I’m not saying Lee’s is good or significantly better, but Lee’s is better. Hill need’s to be wide open to hit the jumper like Lee, but also, all the practice tapes you see of hill is of him hitting it; they don’t show clips of him missing them, which he actually does fairly frequently. I’m not saying I don’t like Hill because I do and he is a much better defender than Lee is, but at this point, he is nowhere near as good offensively as Lee is.
hills jumper was better than lees last year! christ ,LEE BARELY has a jumper
not only that ,HILL also shoots 3’s
HAHAHA, Hill shoots 3’s? That’s how come he hasn’t attempted one of them in his whole college career right?
He hasn’t attempted any but he has 3pt range and his form is excellent.
Yes, because you’ve seen that when he hasn’t taken one his whole college career? Let’s be realistic.
Lee has no jumpshot its not even close. He gave a lot of lip service about how its improved and blah blah blah its a weapon now he was just talking alot of crap.
BOY THAT WAS A LONG STUPID ARGUMENT!LOL
Knicks get
Rubio
Bosh
Raptors get
DLee
Udrich
filler
Knicks ‘12 1st rd pick
Wolves get
Harrington
Sergio Rodriguez
Kings get
Nate
More like:
“
D’antoni gets an orgasm
Raptors fans get pissed off
Hahn rolls around in laughter
Kings fans say “why does everyone else always get the good stuff
Kings give Udrich for Nate. Win for Kings.
Raptors: Bosh for Lee and Udrich. Personally, I see Lee as a better fit between Bargnani and Hedo. Udrich would fit well asa Euro-combo guard off the bench with DeRozan behind Calderon and Wright. And they save $
Wolves: basically it’s Miller and Foye for Harrington, Rodriguez, Etan Thomas and ‘12 1st rd pick.
I honestly don’t see the problems you do.
My problems basically are just in the raptors portion. I would love it, but I don’t see it happening. I just feel like they could get more value for bosh is all.
Throw them the pick instead of Minny then lol. They make out fine wout the pick anyway.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Well that’s constructive. You got a better idea smarty?
“More like:
”
D’antoni gets an orgasm
Raptors fans get pissed off
Hahn rolls around in laughter
Kings fans say “why does everyone else always get the good stuff
Thats what I laughed at, just to clarify. Great post
Oh. My bad,
at least make an offer to SESSIONS ,see what happens
The bucks said they would match any deal for sessions and we can’t offer more than the MLE, so we won’t get him.
show me where thay said that!
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news?slug=rotowire-amonessionsucksakeua&prov=rotowire&type=fantasy
A million sites have it, but basically the only way sessions leaves the bucks is if a team offers him more than the MLE
THANX! arent we gonna have to make a big offer to a good point guard sooner or later?
. They let Charlie V go for a reason….
What other Shooting Guards could we possibly deal him for to include in a Rubio deal? Anyone?
At this point, the odds of a rubio deal getting done are slim to none. We inquired about him two weeks ago. By now, if there was a legit chance of getting him, serious talks would be under way. In regards to Lee for Rudy and cap filler, the blazers can keep rudy and sign millsap, who is the better of the two players. Our best push at rudy would prob be along the lines of nate (via s&t) and chandler for outlaw and rudy. Nate provides a spark and they need a legit, young small forward as batum’s not the answer. We get the expiring in outlaw, who could provide quality minutes off the bench and we get our two of the future. Not to mention that d’antoni praises gallinari, so he is more likely in d’antoni’s plans than chandler is.
We would never do that trade for Rudy.
Reason being…?
We wouldn’t get rid of Wilson unless it was for Rubio or to get Rubio.
Oh sorry donnie walsh, I didn’t know that, LOL. How can you possibly say that? Wilson isn’t needed on this team as much as he once was. Ask around because if we could get a future 2 by losing chandler, there would be no reason not to as long as that 2 was legit, which rudy is.
I’d rather have Wilson play the 2. We drafted Wilson 2 years ago and he’s just improving and learning the game why would we get rid of him. We need to keep our young pieces and we can’t just trade trade trade unless its for a PG.
But wilson’s not a natural two at all. He’s really out of position. I understand that he’s developing, but so is rudy and rudy is a significantly better shooter than Wilson. I agree that it’s hard to let him go, but honestly, d’antoni wants gallinari to start over him and rudy would just be a better fit for the team at this point.
I mean I know Rudy is a more natural 2 and a very good shooter, but I LOVE Wilson. He’s a hard worker and very athletic and can take it to the hoop. Also, his jump shot is really coming along. He is so young and I would say can mold into a good 2 guard alongside Gallo. Since Gallo is such a good shooter I think we could pull off Wilson playing the 2. But unless we are gonna get someone like Rubio, I just don’t think we should get rid of Chandler.
I love him also, but like I said, I just don’t see him being in the knicks plans with gallinari there only because although he can develop his skills at the 2, that’s not his natural position. Rudy could come in here and absolutely light it up. Plus, he’d be a media guru.
D’Antoni has said that his ideal lineup would be five 6′9″ players on the court.
barnaby- To answer your concern, I do not think that this team as currently constructed will be the team that opens the season.
First, if Curry is not traded, hopefully he comes back in shape. Curry did not play at all last season, and his being healthy is already an addition to last year’s team.
Second, the Knicks have brought in a legit center in Milicic with talents suited for this system. The Knicks had David Lee and Jared Jeffries start at center last year. There’s another addition to last year’s team.
Third, both draft picks can help this team, especially Hill. The Knicks brought in Chris Wilcox last year to play a similar role that Hill will be relied on for in his first year. Big, athletic forwards that can finish in transition are valuable assets. The odds are good that Hill does not see much court time to start the season. We might not be able to see his value for a month or so when the season starts.
Fourth, Walsh is not stupid. If all else fails, I am sure that he will bring in a fall-back option to help out at the PG spot. Even if it is Tyron Lue or Brevin Knight, Walsh will bring in a player that can backup Duhon for 15 minutes per game. That is at the very least. He will not bring in some unknown commodity out of the D-League to play backup point. That will not help this team. He needs to find a true NBA player, a player than can hold his own in this league.
I do not think that Walsh will stand pat. He might not make the major moves that we hope for, but I doubt he stands pat.
1- If curry doesn’t come back in shape though (even though now he did lose weight), he has as much trade value to a team as a turkey sandwich and the last time I checked, the GM’s in the nba weren’t starving.
2-I don’t consider Milicic legit. He’s ok, but honestly, to say that he will “re-shape” our team so to speak isn’t very convincing considering he’s one of the biggest draft busts in history and can’t stay on a team for more than two years.
3-I agree, but like you said, both won’t see much playing time. Also, I agree with the chris wilcox role, but that honestly did not make our team THAT much better.
4. A backup point guard isn’t going to make our team into playoff team.
My point chris is that unless DW makes a huge move, I don’t see us as a playoff team b/c the majority of the teams in the east are going to be just as good if not better than last year. Considering we were 14th in the east, I am not confident at all at this point.
Depth is a major key though. I hear you that these moves migth not be earth shattering, but how many more games would we have won last year with some decent depth. Remember the games when only 7 players were eligible to suit up? Remember games when Anthony Roberson was needed to play? The Knicks desperately could have used their three new pieces last year, as well as a backup PG. With some extra depth, we could have been a playoff team.
I suppose it’s arguable and I agree that we needed depth last year to win more games, but this year, I don’t think that depth is needed as much as upgrading talent is. If you look at the east, it’s arguably the strongest it’s been in probably over ten years w/ the recent trades and signings…breaking it down….
boston, cleveland, and orlando are obviously all locks.
Atlanta I feel just had a really good year and won’t be as productive this year, but they will still make the playoffs.
Miami is most likely a lock w. d-wade (assuming he stays healthy)
Now breaking down the last three spots:
Philly is a toss up to get a playoff spot. W/ a good year, we can beat them out.
Chicago will be a lock if they get boozer. Even though they lost gordon, salmons is still a capable scorer and rose will be better.
Detroit is a lock w/ gordon and villanueva IMO. AI didn’t help them out much and although sheed did, that ground can be made up.
Now in regards to our competition with teams that didnt make the playoffs…
Indiana we can beat out
Charlotte will be hard to beat as they are a team thats developing and getting better yearly.
NJ we can beat w/o VC
Milwaukee won’t be good this year w/o charlie and RJ
Toronto will be hard to beat with the upgrade of hedo
Washington could easily be a playoff team again if agent zero could stay healthy for the year. Plus, foye and miller provides them with some shooters.
Overall, I just feel like depth would have got it done last year, but we need more than that this year.
Lets get Matt Barnes in here. He would do well in our system.
Consider trading for Affalo. Detroit is considering getting rid of him. Both guys could be strong role players and neither impacts our cap much.
“Watch Chris Duhon after the opposing team scores a basket. He has the ball up the floor before the other team even has a chance to set up their defense. That allows for a quick shot, hence the “7 seconds or less offense”.
You know who else does this Brandon Jennings who we could have drafted not saying we should have due to his mouth but hes made for SSOL he just cant shut up.
Maybe S Rod can be had from Sac – town for Nate other than that there’s no one else that I can see us picking up that would make a real difference over Duhon.
Is Lee really not enought to get Bayless and Outlaw for Portland if they trade for Kirk.
funny ,i was just thinking about maybe we shoulda drafted JENNINGS
I would agree, but he has too many character issues. Steph Marbury part II.
hes young enough to be coached,especially when we are supposed to have one of the best in the biz
I say we aim for young talent, Rubio, Sessions, Felton, at WORST Jarret Jack
Kahn can’t be serious about keeping Rubio..i say hes our best shot
and if we cant get anybody thats good & under the age of 26 to sign here, call be crazy but i’d be comfortable letting Toney Douglas develop his game for 15-25 minutes per night…
Douglas is an unkown for me. I can sit here and call him an under-sized two guard, but I am not sure how he will react when he gets to the pros. In college, Douglas was the best player on his team. He had to score. In the pros, he might look to pass a bit more. He might be our fall-back option. Look for how he reacts during the summer league. Unlike other guys, he does not have to worry about earning a contract.
Hey I was looking through the list of free agents and I saw Hakim Warrick I think he would be a good fit if we do in the end trade wilson. He doesn’t have much of a shot but he runs the floor real well and he blocks shots so he can replace wilson’s production somewhat. I don’t know if memphis would mach us on any offer (he’s restricted) but I thought it was something to throw out there see what you guys think. I haven’t seen him play much so you guys tell me.
I think Sergio is the way to go for this team hes pass first and a great passer hes on par with Rubio with the way he sees lanes before they open up. He was great in the time that he got in portland hooking up with Rudy for many oops, Sac wanted Nate last year so we should re visit that now that they have S – Rod.
It’s a bit disappointing when 2 free agents over the age of 30 both say no to the Knicks but we have other things to worry about. Getting rid of Eddy Curry and Jared Jeffries should be at the top of Donnie Walsh’s list.
Second, we can’t say Lee is better than Hill just yet. No one expected David Lee to be the double double machine that he is coming out of college right? We need to give Jordan Hill minutes and time, who knows he may actually turn out to be a beast for the Knicks. And we still haven’t seen Gallinari’s potential yet. He’s got the aggressiveness to potentially be better than Dirk Nowitzki. And then there’s Darko Milicic….went to a winning team in the Pistons and a coach that didnt like playing rookies. Then he went to Memphis were the didnt utilize his strengths. We may actually see what Darko can bring to the table in NY. We have some good young players here that just need time and some patience.
I don’t really take either rejection personally (as a Knick fan). Kidd went for significantly more money. This is his last big payday.
Hill is comfortable in Phoenix. He has a great relationship with Nash. It’s like he spurned us for Boston.
Nash not coming to NYC hurts, but I’d much prefer we invest those resources to get Rubio or another young talented PG.
Chris, two questions-
Is Hill better offensively than D-Lee? Because according to bart, right now, Hill has a better jumper, is a better post player, and is just as good of a rebounder as D-lee.
Also, would you do nate and chandler for rudy and outlaw?
Does anyone else think we should have taken Budinger with the 29th pick? I really think he will be a good player and Douglas will never be a starter. Chase has great size and great athleticism for the 2 guard, and can actually shoot and score. I think he can be like a solid 13 and 5 guy.
It’s arguable, but the place would have exploded if the knicks didn’t take a point at 29. With that said, we have a few similar players to him (chandler, when he plays the two is oversized and gallinari is an oversized forward who can shoot). He would be a good piece and I honestly, don’t like Douglas, but I don’t think that they were thinking about him at 29. If it were up to me, my pick would have been Dejuan Blair personally…
i would have to agree with,,,chase would have been a solid professional for us.He can pop the three,and he is just a great overall shooter. he moves very well without the ball, which is a great thing for the seven seconds or less offense, which is really getting the best shot possible before the defense of the other team can set up. He also was a teammate of jordan hill in college, so to draft both of them would have been somewhat comfortable for them. However, i am not doubting douglas. I feel like he was a hidden gem in the draft, otherwise i dont know why Walsh would cough up three million to LA for that pick. He plays defense and can def. shoot. In collegehe was the best player on his squad…in the NBA he wont b,,,,so i think he would adjust to that role and play the pure poing guard role. If we need him to score and play defense, we at least know that he cans. Im calling it now, he will be that hidden gem everyone forgot, watch
otherwise i dont know why Walsh would cough up three million to LA for that pick.
Because per NBA rules, a 1st rd pick costs $3m. No negotiating the price. 1st rd picks cost $3m, period. End. Of. Story.
(I’m not chastising you specifically, but I’ve seen it questioned a few times and it bothers me.)
O not at all bruno,lol, i understand. I apologize, i should of stated my point more clearly. I mean that Walsh would not have went out of the way if he wasn’t impressed with Douglas enough to trade that 3 million for his pick. I read numerous teams liked what he did against the more popular guards in the draft workouts.( i.e. curry, lawson,jennings,flynn.) Think about it,,,,why not trade that three million for the 18th pick or 16th pick which were up for grabs, and jrue holiday went 16th so philly…..think about it..weren’t the knicks really big on Holiday??? we could have snagged him we that 3 million. Why go for 29th and scoop douglas??? he definitely has the skills that D’ANTONI FEELS WILL THRIVE IN THE SSOL OFFENSE.
I agree. Plus Walsh said if TD weren’t there he would’ve traded the pick. So, I’m fully confident that the kid can play the 1.
We easily should have taken Budinger over TD I thought they would have picked him up he was there for the taking.
douglas right now is prolly the best shut down dee guy we have,but i was really hoping we would take buddinger at the time
barnaby- To answer your two questions:
1) Lee’s offensive game is underrated. A jump shot for a forward is not as important as being able to finish at the rim. David Lee shoots close to 56% every year. He is extremely talented at finishing with both hands around the hoop. I think his jumper is better than people give credit for, but the fact remains that while he can be a better jump shooter, his ability to score on pick’n'rolls and his ability to score off of putbacks are his best offesive attributes. In terms of scoring at least. I am not sure if I would call Hill a better offensive player than Lee. Lee is a better player right now. D’Antoni even said so himself.
2) Probably not. I think Wilson is worth more than Rudy and Nate is worth more than Outlaw. I would do Nate for Outlaw because I like Outlaw and he would be better than getting nothing back for Nate. But I would not trade Wilson for Rudy straight up. That is just my opinion, but no I would not make that trade.
Thanks chris. In regards to one, I completely agree. I was having a convo about it up in this thread and I don’t see Jordan Hill penetrating the lane like Lee does. Nor do I see his post game being as strong. Physically, Jordan needs to bulk up a bit. And I pointed out Lee’s shooting from the field because very few are able to put those type of numbers up with the exception of players like d12 who dunk the ball 60% of the time.
In regards to two, I would do that trade personally. The only reason being that I don’t see chandler having a future on this team. I know he has more upside than rudy, but honestly, I feel like d’antoni is enamored by Gallo and he’s going to be our starting 3. Chandler to me just seems out of place at the 2. He can play it, but it’s obviously not his natural position. I just feel like Rudy could come in here and average, in his prime, 20 a game in our system. Granted, Wilson may also be able to do that for us in his prime as well. I suppose it’s arguable.
You cant underrate offensive game when he has none he can’t create his own shot in a iso situation if he could he would have a offer sheet by now hes good and dunking and layups around the rim hes extremely inefficient shooting the ball hes just not that good and his defense sucks.
_avi_ Lee aka No D. Lee has a very limited offensive game. He’s been in the league 4 years, and while his jump shooting FORM has improved it really has only showed tangible results at the free throw line (although he made a habit of choking when they counted last season).
He still has little to no confidence in the jumpshot which prevents it from being considered a weapon for him. He is a very good finisher on the break in transition or as a trailer and rolling to the basket on pick and roll plays.
However if you notice once teams figured out that Lee couldn’t pick and pop to hit the J, Chris Duhon wasn’t going to look to score on the drive, that pick and roll play was useless and Duhon’s turnovers skyrocketed the second half of the season.
Also _avi_ has a problem with getting blocked a lot in the paint for someone with better than average athleticism. He hasn’t learned how to pump fake in FOUR YEARS!!!! WTH?!!!
Oh, did I mention he doesn’t play defense?
EVERYONE MAKES UP THESE DUMB TRADES THAT WOULD NEVER HAPPEN. LOOK & THINK ABOUT THIS TRADE…
1. KNICKS WANT RUBIO AND MONEY OFF THE CAP RIGHT?
2. BLAZERS WANT LEE RIGHT?
3. TIMBERWOLVES WOULD WANT BACK SOMETHING FOR RUBIO RIGHT?
SO WHY NOT DO..
KNICKS GET RUBIO AND TAKE BRAIN CARDINAL A BAD CONTRACT FROM MINNESOTA.
BLAZERS GET DAVID LEE, COREY BREWER FROM MINNESOTA AND 2 MILLION FROM THE KNICKS
TWOLVES GET AL HARRINGTON, RUDY FERNANDEZ FROM PORTLAND AND A 2012 FIRST ROUNDER.
That doesn’t look too bad, except the Blazers are probably gonna sign Millsap.
1. Blazers give up Rudy for D-Lee straight up? Are you serious?
2. Knicks give up Al Harrington and D-Lee for Rubio and bad contracts which is hilarious.
3. T-Wolves get rudy, harrington, and a first rounder all for Ricky Rubio, cardinal, and a bad contract. Again, hilarious.
And who’s first roudner is that because either way it throws the trade way off. Just stop posting in this threads man.
What’s wrong with Rudy for D Lee straight up? Who do you think it’s bad for?
D-Lee has significantly higher trade value at this point than Rudy does.
In my opinion, I wouldn’t even pay the money to re-sign David Lee anyway, so I think using him to get Rubio would be great. With the lowering cap and everything I just don’t see why we should pay David Lee 8-10 million dollars for what he does. To me, he is not worth that kind of money. Besides being a good rebounder, he is DECENT at everything else. I see him always being just DECENT player and I just don’t think he’s worth all that money.
You might think that but GMs would disagree with you.
Gms disagree on what? Notice that Lee hasn’t gotten any offers and DW doesn’t wanna pay him that money either…
Well yeah it’s because his agent is on crack. His agent wants him to get 12 mil a year while Ron Artest got 6. The fact is that if Lee asked for the same money as people on his level, he would get a million bites. The problem is that his agent is on cloud nine because i’m not sure if an all-star would get 12 mil in this economy.
Thats what im saying Lee is overrated by some but GMs know hes not that good Rudy for him straight up would be kinda crazy but its not that far off Walsh just trires to boost his value with his statements.
Knicks get
Rubio
Bosh
Raptors get
DLee
Udrich
filler
Knicks ‘12 1st rd pick
Wolves get
Harrington
Sergio Rodriguez
Kings get
Nate
Too good to be true. Raptors would not take Lee and give up Bosh. Wolves wouldn’t take Harrington and S-Rod for Rubio. Kings and Knicks might be happy but the other two would never do it.
As for Chase Budinger, I feel weird answering this question because I have been a big fan of his since he was a freshman at Arizona. I have written a number of times about his potential as a big, athletic, and strong shooting guard with the ability to light up a scoreboard. I would have strongly considered him at 29, as I would have with Sam Young. Both could have played, and potentially started at SG. But DW and MD love Douglas, as do a lot of analysts. I was initially upset with the pick, but it can work out, especially if he shows some passing ability.
I don’t think Douglas would be bad, but I feel like Budinger is more NBA ready and could have came in and started. He’s a smart player who knows how and when to pass, but can also score and shoot very well. He would work hard and since he’s very athletic, could run the court in D’Antoni’s system and be able to guard the big 2’s.
Definitely just with his size at the 2G he should have been a big time consideration on top of that he can shoot and is extremely explosive to quote Jay Bilas ” HE’S A FREAK ATHLETE ” high IQ he would be great in SSOL and he was rated as high as 10 in some mocks early on.
I BELIEVE WE STILL HAVE A FULL SEASON OF BASKETBALL TO PLAY, SO IN THE LONG-RUN, WE MUST FOCUS ON THIS SEASON. WE LOST OUT ON KIDD AND HILL, AND IF NASH RESIGNS WELL THATS ANOTHER ONE WE LOST OUT ON. iF THE CAP ROOM SITUATION COMES INTO EFFECT, THAN WE CAN ONLY SIGN ONE MAX FREE AGENT NEXT SEASON. JOPEFULLY THIS ISNT TRUE BUT LETS JUST START PREPARING FOR IT AS IF IT IS GOING DOWN THAT WAY. WE NEED MORE PIECES, BUT I BELIEVE WE HAVE SOLID BALLERS NOW. CHANDLER IS WORKING ON HIS BALL HANDLING ABILITY, SO HES GONNA BE A BEAST. GALO WILL ONLY GET BETTER, AND LEE AND HILL WOULD BE A GREAT COMBINATION. I FEEL WE ONLY REALLY HAVE HOLES IN THE 1 AND 2 GUARD POSITIONS. I DONT SEE US SNAGGING ANDRE MILLER, ALTHOUGH I WOULD REALLY HAPPY IF WE DID. IN THE END, I FEEL LIKE THAT JEFFRIES DEAL WILL GO DOWN FOR MIKE JAMES, WE WILL SIGN MORRIS ALMOND FROM OUR SUMMER LEAGUE SQUAD, WHICH IS A GOOD THING BECAUSE HE CAN SHOOT, DRIVE, AND PLAY DEFENSE. i THINK THERE IS A POSSIBILITY OF A NATE DEAL, AND CURRY WILL BE DEALT AT THE TRADE DEADLINE IF WE CANT PULL THE TRIGGER ON THAT TMAC FOR CURRY DEAL. KEY FREE AGENTS OUT THERE…MARVIN WILLIAMS,,,,,RAMON SESSIONS,,,ODOM,,,FELTON. WE CANT USE OUR MLE ON AT LEAST THREE OF THEM CAUSE TEAMS WILL MATCH. WASSUP WITH MARVIN WILLIAMS,,,,SOLID DEFENDER,,,CAN DEF. SCORE…..GREAT SHOOTER…POTENTIAL ALL-STAR. HE CAN RUN THE THREE AND CHANDLER THE 2. i GUESS HE WANTS MORE THAN THE MLE TOO RIGHT?
We just don’t need him at this point. Too many 3’s/4’s. Harrington, Chandler, and Gallinari are all similar players to Marvin. He’s just overkill on our team at the moment.
You know that button under “TAB”? Press it….
I like Marvin Williams and he definitely has All-Star potential but he’s a 3/4 tweener and we already have three players like that (Gallinari, Chandler, Harrington). And he has a bad back…
thanx for the pep talk,but i disagree on a couple of things. CHANDLER will never be a beast, MORRIS ALMOND cant play a lick of defense,and we dont have many solid ballers . just my opinion,calm down its only basketball, dont be like KID TARHEEL and act as if im dumber than you.if we were all that smart,we wouldnt be bloggn
lololol i am extremely calm bob,, i apologize..i know that caps looks like a person is yelling on a blog, i forgot to take mine off before i sent this lol
no i wasnt refering to your caps,its about a reply i got from another guy
If chandler developes his ball handling a little bit, which he has been all summer, he has the potential to be one. I take it you never saw Almond play in Utah where he was a solid shot blocker type defender like Chandler is. We have solid ballers, we just need to develop the chemistry a little more and acquire a solid point guard to run the SSOL offense even though besides sessions and felton(who both will most likely resign) there are none out there at the time an moment. Hopefully Walsh can do some solid moves before training camp so the chemistry can be developed from day one
you are very optimistic,i am of the opinion that the players we have now(minus lee n nate)cant win 30 games.no point guard,HUGHS at the 2(UGH!) CHANDLER is physicaly good but doesnt have basketball brains,GALLO(i hope)is gonna be the goods,HARRINGTON EH!,DARKO is almost a bust,the new guys have to develop. if we dont get a good point guard(cuz i really hate DUHON) we are never going to get the big free agents to sign with us and all of the cap room in the world wont mean shit
Chris, one more question because I’m getting a kick out of this thread. Do you see Jordan Hill shooting three’s anytime soon? According to two fans of his in this thread, Hill has the capability of shooting 3’s although he didn’t attempt one his entire college career.
thats the last thing we need. The knicks are already criticized about being soft. Now that we finally got an aggressive foward who can bang donwlow, you want him to shoot threes, thus leaving the paint unattended for rebounds???? thats the last thing we need….his game has been compared to amares….lets leave it at that and hopes it only gets to that level…
Thank you eprenuer. We don’t need him to shoot 3’s at all and to say that he can when he hasn’t taken one his entire college career is beyond ridiculous.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F5D_phze-7A
He shoots a 3 in this vid again like I said his form gives him range from any where on the court never said he should be out the launching 3pt BOMBs thats what we have Eddy for.
I didn’t see it, tell me where. With that aside, Jordan Hill isn’t here to shoot 3’s. And relying on eddy to play in the post while hill “launches 3’s” is beyond ridiculous, as are you sir.
My bad. Misread your comment.
LOL what are you talking about, What im saying is he can shoot threes, I’m not expecting him to be out there shooting threes, I’m basically saying he has a better jumper than Lee he has range from Mid and 3pt land.
see above post…
@ 1:31
We can’t get guys who are on the other side of their careers(Kidd and Hill) to come here never mind a stud like James or Wade.
All we are doing is setting ourselves up for as big let down in one year.
Less talent AND less money to offer. These guys can and do get advertising and fame in the markets that they are in already.
I have a bad feeling someone(2 different teams) is going to blindside the Cavs and Heat and sign Wade and James.C’mon can’t you see the Spurs/Pistons or someone with some recent sucess signing a James or Wade.
This season we will be lucky to win 30 games. Don’t make the mistake that other players are going to be tripping over themselves to take our money or play with our players.
DW should be trying to get us back into the 2010 1st round and losing Hughes, Jefferies and Eddy”Jack Lalane ” Curry. And getting us something for Lee and Robinson.
I really hope I am wrong about the scenario I just painted.
Ok, I’m done with this thread. Not trying to sound conceited or arrogant, but there are numerous fans in this thread that are beyond ridiculous. These are the conclusions that I’ve come to:
1. Fans feel that this year, Jordan Hill will be more productive than David Lee will be. They feel that his offensive game overall is much better/established than D-Lee’s.
2. Fans feel that Jordan Hill can shoot 3’s and he has the range when he hasn’t attempted one in his entire college career.
3. Fans feel that a D-Lee for Rudy trade straight up is a good deal on both ends.
4. Fans feel that we have a chance as sessions after the bucks didn’t pursue charlie and extended a qualifying offer to Sessions.
5. Fans feel that D-Lee has “no offensive ability”
6. Fans feel that since D-Lee was selected at 30th in a strong draft class and Jordan Hill was selected 8th in one of the weakest draft classes in history, Jordan Hill is automatically going to be the better player.
If you don’t see anything wrong with some of these claims, then honestly, whatever you’re on must be some good stuff. Pass it please.
I think one day not this season but one day J Hill will be better than D Lee because he plays better D. I think he would have range like Chris Bosh, Bosh can shoot the three but won’t just run over there and spot up.
I agree, one day. People were arguing that if we got rid of d-lee, harrington, and chandler and after all of that, picked up rubio; our team would be ok w/ just rubio, gallinari, and jordan hill. And that Hill would come in and dominate and be better offensively this year than D-Lee. I basically said “you can’t be serioius”.
i agree
Come on dude you give Lee too much credit i showed you the Vid where Hill shot a three and I remember Mike D saying he could shoot threes he did in the pre draft workouts. Any NBA scout will tell you that J Hill has more upside than D Lee if you like Lee you like Lee but Hill has potential and more tools than Double Double Lee.
Bart, I’m not saying that Hill will not be better than Lee b/c he probably will be. I’m just saying that as a rookie, he will not be on Lee’s level offensively.
people are entitled to their opinion,just because its not the same as yours ,doesnt mean its wrong.also you cant call a draft class weak,until about 3 or 4 years after it takes place.
BARNABY8787
HOW IS MY TRADE BAD IF IT HELPS THE KNICKS GIVES THE BLAZERS DAVID LEE WHO THEY WANT AND RUDY FERNENDEZ IS UNHAPPY IN PORTLAND AND MINNY GETS TALENT AND A 1ST ROUNDER FOR A PLAYER WHO DOESNT WANT TO BE THERE.
STOP with the all caps please.
why does everyone get bothered by caps?
You don’t find it annoying/difficult to read?
i find it easier to read at my age……ITS BIGGER
For the love god man, I explained it already. I’ll simplify.Portland doesn’t give up enough, Knicks give up WAAAY too much, T-Wolves get WAAAY too much.
For the love god man LOL
LOL, i would have to disagree…Have us New Yorker become to have no faith in our players????? David lee was robbed of an all star appearence this past season. he could of easily taken rashard, mo williams, or even ray allens all star spot. He had better season than all of them, he was just overlooked because they all had winning season. Mo was a beast this year but lets be honest, he only made it because he had a 40 point game the week of the all star game right before Bosh could be in it so he needed a replacement. Lee is a great rebounder and led the league in double-doubles!!! hes only getting better. Everyone have respect in your players enough to at least trade them for equal or better value.Although fernandez will be a beast, but we just get smaller after this deal. Why not package lee and nate for a more respectable trade like for amare or bosh. How can those teams look at us sideways for that offer??? Lee and nate bonified solid professionals. Lets be honest, i dont see Bosh or Amare with ther respective teams past this season, with turkoglu or not…with hill and nash resigning or not…..stop trying to tradenate and lee for nothing….we developed these guys,,,,there only gonna get better. Nate is a beast when hes on point. The only reason he didnt wint 6th man of the year…cause terry and the mavericks made the playoffs. Lee robbed of an all star appearence. Whats the result???? eastern conference gets blown out by the west…lol…great game by the way…..even Jalen rose and chriss webber and barkley all said they neede rebounding and height and lee woulda helped instead of jamming that roster with like 3 4 point guards…lol..point case….lets looks for great deals if were gonna trade nate or lee….2010 is not promised…so lets stop talking lee for fernandez or blake and outlaw…or nate for kenny thomas….get value and equal talent at that.
His three point shooting ability was touted a bit in his pre-draft workouts, but he is not going to live out there. He might take one or two every few games, but I think his shooting prowess comes from the mid-range, which is a good thing. If he is athletic and a good rebounder, then we want him as close to the hoop as possible.
So to answer that question, no I do not see Hill being a major threat from downtown.
Here’s a thought…. would anyone trade Al Harrington for Blake and Outlaw? If Portland gets Hinrich and does not have to give up Bayless, Blake is expendable. Hanrrington is more of a Hedo type of player than Outlaw.
Would that be selling low on Harrington, a 20 ppg scorer? Blake and Duhon are lower end starting caliber PGs, but together they can form a consistently strong tandem for 48 mpg.
would anyone trade Al Harrington for Blake and Outlaw?
Only if I can’t Rubio for Harrington, which I think DW can.
Eh, I don’t see that as an upgrade to our team really Chris. Outlaw is unnecessary and I don’t think blake would have a significant effect on our team. I’d rather hold onto him personally.
Maybe throw in the rights to Patty Mills and let him play overseas for a year?
Patty mills just broke his foot reports on espn. He broke it on the first day of practice with the blazers
Yeah I think Harrington is worth more too. It’s not awful, and at least Outlaw is only 24 years old, but Harrington is pretty good.
Just a thought. I am not saying that either team would really consider it.
It can help both teams, but it’s not likely to ever be considerd. Just thiking out loud.
Chris Alvino may have hit on the sleeper aquisition that s/b made. Just did quick research on CJ Watson and he has everything we need to share the PG spot with Duhon. He’s quick, plays defense, decent FG & 3PT FG percentages, great FT %, AND he’s only 25 !!! Make the move NOW Donnie Basketball and later for those over the (grant) hill types or unattainable cap killers we’ve been chasing. All together now, CJ, CJ, CJ !
Just forget that one I guess.
But yeah I do not see Hill being a major outside threat for us. If he proves me wrong, then great. But I think his ability to shoot comes from the mid-range.
David Lee’s has a better understanding of the game (offensively), he’s clearly a better passer and he has a stronger body.
Jordan Hill is taller, more athletic and he could be a better jumpshooter, a better post-player and a better defender.
Lee’s obviously better than Hill because we have yet to see how his game translates to the NBA but Jordan has a higher ceiling, like I said I think he’ll be a poor man’s Jermaine O’Neal.
He Kinda reminds me of Aldridge.
Really?
Aldridge is a finesse player, a great jumpshooter and an average rebounder. Jordan Hill is more athletic and tends to play harder in the paint – he’s a better rebounder as well but still an average jumpshooter.
I don’t see it – no disrespect.
I’m probably just looking at the jumpshot, your right Hill is a beast in the paint.
they say his game reminds people of Amare…so lets just hope that becomes true. I would take jermaine O’Neal comparison..a Jermaine that was in his prime ofcourse lol,,,that help lead the Pacers to the Eastern Conference Finals ofcourse lol but hill will be a beast ,,,everyone should stop sleeping on him…he bangs with authority on people and hes a shot blocker….so hes slightly better than lees overall game, but way more athletic
Chris, I think we might really regret not considering Budinger. He will be a very solid player, and he really doesn’t have much of a downside.
To add to my comment before, fans feel that rudy fernandez has more trade value than d-lee.
You were ready to trade Chandler for Rudy barnaby, saying that we have too many people in his position. We also have a lot of people in Lee’s position and trading Lee would at least save us money, but dealing Chandler would lose us money because he’s still on his rookie salary…I don’t see how you’d give up Wilson for Rudy but not D Lee.
It’s different though because for one, Lee led this team last year, but with that aside, I was just pointing out that we have Gallinari to replace chandler. Granted, we have J-Hill to replace Lee, but I just feel that Lee is much more valuable to this team than chandler at this point.
I see your point, but I disagree. Sure Lee helped to lead the team, but Chandler averaged 14 and 5 and he didn’t even start in that many games. Lee is a little older and more advanced, and he got more opportunities and was much more of a go-to-guy. Considering the touches Lee got compared to Chandler, I think Wilson is MUCH more valuable. I don’t think Lee will ever be any better than he was last year, and his stats are a little bloated due to the system. Lee is a 6′8-6′9 PF and he’s a pretty good player, but Chandler has more potential to be a better player than Lee.
Wilson played one less minute a game than Lee. Lee led the league in double doubles. Without Lee, we would have been dead last in rebounding in the league last year. And to say that Chandler has more potential is arguable considering that Lee is still developing as well. Also, you point at the system and Lee benefitting from it, but is Chandler doing exactly?
No because Chandler didn’t get nearly as many touches as Lee did. All the half court game was about Lee and when Harrington or Nate was in they took a ton of touches that should have been Wilson’s. And I don’t see Lee being any better than this. I think his stats make him look a lot better than he is. He’s overrated.
LOL, i would have to disagree…Have us New Yorker become to have no faith in our players????? David lee was robbed of an all star appearence this past season. he could of easily taken rashard, mo williams, or even ray allens all star spot. He had better season than all of them, he was just overlooked because they all had winning season. Mo was a beast this year but lets be honest, he only made it because he had a 40 point game the week of the all star game right before Bosh could be in it so he needed a replacement. Lee is a great rebounder and led the league in double-doubles!!! hes only getting better. Everyone have respect in your players enough to at least trade them for equal or better value.Although fernandez will be a beast, but we just get smaller after this deal. Why not package lee and nate for a more respectable trade like for amare or bosh. How can those teams look at us sideways for that offer??? Lee and nate bonified solid professionals. Lets be honest, i dont see Bosh or Amare with ther respective teams past this season, with turkoglu or not…with hill and nash resigning or not…..stop trying to tradenate and lee for nothing….we developed these guys,,,,there only gonna get better. Nate is a beast when hes on point. The only reason he didnt wint 6th man of the year…cause terry and the mavericks made the playoffs. Lee robbed of an all star appearence. Whats the result???? eastern conference gets blown out by the west…lol…great game by the way…..even Jalen rose and chriss webber and barkley all said they neede rebounding and height and lee woulda helped instead of jamming that roster with like 3 4 point guards…lol..point case….lets looks for great deals if were gonna trade nate or lee….2010 is not promised…so lets stop talking lee for fernandez or blake and outlaw…or nate for kenny thomas….get value and equal talent at that
what a whacky thread
Biggie, please shed some light in this situation b/c I consider you one of the more practical people in this forum. I wish I could say the same for some others…
u guys are 153 into it.. im afraid ill lose my whole weekend
lol,,how so BIG??? i agree your a knowledgeable voice in these forums….i need your opinion on this…..do you agree with everyone else to trade lee for Rudy straight up and nate for kenny thomas…or do you agree with me and seek max value trades for our players who had solid seasons????
personally i would move anyone on this team to shake things up.
Lee for Rubio str8 up doesnt work .. pretty unrealistic from both sides..
I dont want to dump nate for a bag of balls when he has nO offers and will play for the QO this year.
we need some young cheap players who coach D can turn into assets.. Like PEJr and Almond and whomever else is on a rookie deal..
I like J Hill .. probably potentially more than Lee but Lee has obviously done more..but I dont want to buy him more than 6.5 per on a LT Deal.
J HIll has a better outside shot right now.. Anyone who says Lee has a jumper is hallucinating.
trading Harrington PLUS for Rubio is the best deal..
I like the Jeffries for Mike James talk obviously..
Dont have much use for Duhon long term.
Didnt someone smart once say there are lies.. damn lies and statistics?
be patient and lets go knicks.. will be a long summer.
not Rubio, RUDY
straight up? No.. that doesnt work financially or talent wise..
Lee for Rudy F. and Outlaw? yes. throw in a first rounder and ill drive him and his GF to the airport.
they could say whatever they want about Lee and Nate…but statistics dont lie…remember that..lol
I’ve got to go, but just as a last comment, I think that most of you guys underrate Lee tremendously. Lee led the league in double doubles last year. He contributed to over a quarter of our rebounds (both offensively and defensively) single-handedly. People say that Chandler or others are more valuable to our team, but our team can still thrive without chandler while if we gave up lee for nothing, we would probably be the worst rebounding team in the league. To say that we can throw Jordan Hill into the fire and he can produce like Lee is both premature as well as naive considering Hill dominated against boys in college. I’m not saying that Hill won’t be better than Lee because there’s a decent chance that he will be; but at this moment, he is not on D-Lee’s level. Also, you can’t blame the system saying that it’s the only reason why D-Lee produced because everyone uses the system to their advantage. Look at Nate. Nate is never going to average 17 points in a half-court system focused on defense as opposed to “out-scoring” opponents so to speak. Every player on this team has somewhat inflated stats. In the same respect, it does not take away from their talent as well as their abilities to play the game.
At least I’m moving Lee and Nate for Bosh.
Who kills who in practice Lee or Hill ? I say Hill MURDERS him
If Lee is here, I guarantee he won’t…yes, Hill has better D but D-Lee will throw him around…
I like Lee too. But, I don’t believe I’ve ever seen Lee throw anyone around on the court
LOL Come On once again you can’t be serious.
Thank you barnaby,,,, i take it u agree with me??
Bruno, i wasn’t objecting the concept; I was just saying the trade was unbalanced adn yes epreneur…
I know. Just taking pride in the fact that at least I’m not with the other group trying to sell for pennies on the dollar. I’m boat with you guys, getting MAX value for our “assets”.
Bass to the Magic… Good move for them, gives them a banger next to Dwight off the bench.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/basketball/nba/07/10/bass.ap/index.html
Are we still on the 2010 plan or what?
Donnie should do a state of the Knicks address, the people have a right to know, lol
To people who think donnie is failing by not making moves… i just don’t know what to say anymore… All you can do at this phase in the process is stay young, remain flexible, and wait for the right opportunities to come along. We will keep getting better with our developing youth and by searching for cheap veterans (we still have both exceptions available.) At some point, even if it is not lebron or wade, a great player(s) will come along and we will deem him the best possible player for us and we will go after him. Untill then, YOUTH< FELXIBILITY, AND PATIENCE. Our time will come.
Yea, I’d love a PG, but the knicks don’t own the NBA. The fact that we are sticking with Duhon is proof that we are finally displaying the patience and discretion that is necessary… You don’t just go out signing whoever you can find, that is how you end up with a random assortment of talented players who don’t fit well together, and you end up stuck for 5 years.
i love what we are doing; sure, a lot of things didn’t go our way this summer, but that is not Donnie’s fault. The fact that we can absorb those blows and still stick to the plan so that our future is still wide open makes me happy for the first time in a while.
I’m not going to point out specific comments any more, along the lines of “we don’t have any new great players and other teams do so donnie is a failure and now we are screwed forever,” because i realized there are so many people like that out there who just don’t understand, but as long as I understand, and the writer’s of this blog seem to understand, i can be at ease.
Great article Chris.
I bet your tune changes when Lebron signs that extension in July.
Do you seriously look at this as either get lucky and get lebron to sign with us (its his choice, not ours) or its a failure? There are so many franchise players, new ones emerge every couple of years. 16 months from now there will be a new group of a few unbelievable players who are the future of the league and they will be becoming free agents eventually also.
We can’t control LeBron… ONE player… get over it, he comes or he doesn’t.
yea, of course i want lebron, but you can’t look at it like that its just ridiculous. If we stay young, and keep getting better while maintaining flexibility, then we will eventually get a really great guy or two, we just have to make sure we don’t ruin our chances. Stay flexible, develop players from scratch, and be patient; one of our young guys is bound to become an allstar under d’antoni.
If you look at it as narrowly as “everything is a failure if lebron re-signs ,” than you aren’t really a knicks fan. I want lebron, but i will not consider this a failure if we don’t get him. What we are doing, it isn’t for him. That’s just how the media labels it. it’s for building a good team in general… its for improving and establishing a culture and making sure we have the space to bring in a player LIKE lebron if one every comes our way… this is the way you do it… it takes a while, but this is how you do it. Lebron, Wade, bosh, Durant, Randolph, Beasley, Mayo, Westbrook, Griffin, Rubio, Howard, Chris Paul, carmelo… The list goes on and on, some of those younger ones might become the next chris paul or the next kobe even, and in 3 years there will be 10 more who you couldn’t even name yet.
This isn’t about lebron, you read espn too much.
We still have a bunch of expiring contracts, a few of whom we KNOW are expendable, (plus mobly’s great deal) and Nate and Lee (whichever we decide to move, if either.) so we still have a lot of room the make some serious moves to put us in a better spot going forward. The fact that we haven’t done anything yet just proves that we are having discretion and being careful and waiting for the perfect opportunity. Rushing and making moves out of a sense of urgency is irresponsible and risky.
I like that Walsh hasn’t done anything. Think what would be happening if this was Isiah. He’s waiting for the right opportunity and I’m expecting something by the end of the summer to go down that will be very good for us. Truthfully I think Donnie has been being quiet because he’s working on a Rubio deal with Kahn. I don’t buy any of what Kahn or anybody says, Rubio has to be dealt. I think Donnie is working on it and if he makes a move too quick he could miss out on something better later on. He knows this and so does D’antoni. That duo REALLY know basketball and they won’t do anything stupid.
Thank you Chris! CJ Watson should be seriously considered now.
Its about winning folks…
Knicks wont have a chance . Donnie has to really make some bold moves this summer , making the knicks better while keeping the cap space….
I bet he’s waiting on the outcome of Lee & Nate before wheeling and dealing