What Can Get The Ball Rolling?

by Chris Alvino on August 9th, 2009 at 1:26 pm

The David Lee situation has dragged on for far too long… and it looks like Donnie Walsh has played it perfectly.

Leading into midnight, July 1st, I was sure that Lee would get sniffs almost immediately. Now, almost a month and a half into free agency, Lee has nothing to show for his (and his agent’s) efforts this summer.

Comparable talents have gotten their deals. Millsap with his 4 year, $32 million deal with the Jazz (via the Blazers). Lamar Odom with his 4 year, $33 million deal with the Lakers. It has been a buyer’s market thus far in the NBA free agent market. The financial problems of many teams have restricted the types of contracts being offered and signed by players. Players of a similar ilk would have been signed to much greater deals in the past. But… these are the times!

I do not blame Lee for holding out. Despite us fans seemingly taking this summer minute by minute, the reality of the situation is that there is no rush to get something done. Training camp opens at the end of September. Until then, does it really make a difference what happens with Lee’s contract status? So long as Lee is staying in basketball shape, and I have no reason to believe that he is the type to be getting lazy, the Knicks can bring him back in September.

But I am sure that Lee is getting frustrated. His problem is that Walsh is a patient guy. Walsh has a clear-cut understanding of the market and of what the future holds in store for the Knicks organization. He has a plan, a plan that he is not likely to deviate from.

So what can get the ball rolling? Walsh will not S&T Lee for a contract that runs longer than 1 more year. At the same time, Walsh will not trade Lee for an expiring contract that will not help the Knicks on the court in 2009-2010. So cross that off the list. But what if a team offered Lee the full MLE. Would Lee consider taking that deal if there was an out clause after three seasons? If the reports are true that Lee has a 4 year, $38 million offer from the Knicks on the table, then I doubt he would. However, if that offer is out there, I am surprised that he would not take it. That said, Lee can probably work out a deal with the Knicks for more than the MLE and below his believed asking price. I am willing to pretty much cross the MLE idea off the list as well.

So what will get the ball rolling on this situation? According to Chad Ford, this is the story for the Knicks next summer:

“The Knicks aren’t too far behind New Jersey. They could have $24 million in cap space next summer, though there are a few caveats for Knicks fans.

First, that number is with only six players under contract and six minimum cap holds. Second, it doesn’t factor in David Lee or Nate Robinson. If they sign for more than a one-year deal, the number goes down significantly. GM Donnie Walsh will try hard this summer to trade Jared Jeffries and/or Eddy Curry for an expiring contract to clear more cap space, but in this economic climate, it won’t be easy.”

If Lee signs for $8 million per season and Sessions comes here for $5 million, that is an extra $13 million on the books, not counting the cap holds and all of the the other cap issues. That cap space is precious, and if Ford is correct, then you can all see just how precious that space becomes.

So it is becoming more and more clear to me as to why a 1 year deal for Lee would make sense. Walsh wants to be a player next summer in the free agent market. We all want Walsh to be a player in the free agent market next summer. With the cap number projecting to fall, moving Eddy Curry‘s contract becomes even more important. A contending team might be willing to take on the extra year of Curry to get Lee for a playoff push.

The summer drags along, and so does the David Lee situation. I would love to say that it will clear up in the near future, but I cannot say that for sure. I am fairly certain that it will come to a head before training camp, but I am not even certain on that.

About Chris Alvino

Chris Alvino grew up in Crestwood, NY. He graduated from Regis High School in 2005. There he played both basketball and baseball. Chris is currently a student at Boston College, where he practices with the varsity Women's Basketball Team (... seriously). Chris has been a Knicks' fan for years and can literally talk about them all day long, every day of the week. Chris enjoys writing on this blog and seeing what everyone out there has to say about it. View all posts by Chris Alvino →
  • MUGSY

    Whatever happened to jeffries for mike james

  • BiggieSmalls

    How could you say this is not solely on Lee when Lee is asking for 11-12 mil per year in a market where comparable and better players are getting 8?

  • Chris Alvino

    Well what is wrong with Lee holding out? What does he have to lose by holding out? Right now, the ball appears to be in Lee’s court. It is up to him to cave in… not Donnie.

  • CircleLimit4

    I think we were all expecting Lee to highball the market, it’s not surprising that Lee isn’t getting 12 million. What’s surprising is that he hasn’t received ANY offers from other teams.

  • BiggieSmalls

    I just think you guys are giving Lee a pass after he told everyone including Tommy Dee that he wanted to stay in NYC and would play here for a discount yet he is now standing fast and “holding out” for 50% above market.

    And that is all somehow now OK and characterized as Donnie playing hardball?

    If Lee really has 4/38 “on the table” and isnt taking that and running he is delusional. From the Agents comments in teh press I would not doubt that he would reject it. After all, Lee “played for a discount” for the past 4 years.

    Donnie should really play hard ball and pull his offers with just the QO left. Then let Lee sign an Offer sheet with Miami for the MLE (like Ariza had to do with the Rockets after Buss played hard ball with him)

  • BiggieSmalls

    we were?

    If I remember most pundits were expecting Lee to quickly sign on long term for a significant discount to the market because he loved playing and living in NYC and wanted to be a part of the whole rebirth.

    Nate was the one shooting for the moon and Lee was ready to commit long term to a discounted deal. Model Girlfriend in NYC, sushi with D Wright and all..

  • CircleLimit4

    I was.

    I think it’s a little naive to believe that a few extra million wouldn’t come between D. Lee and his sushi. Lee is coming off a career year, of course he’s gonna try to get every dollar he can. Bartlestein might be overzealous as an agent, but he’s an agent nonetheless and he’s doing his job. They just severely overestimated the market.

    A discount only really crossed my mind after weeks passed and no offers came to Lee. Maybe going down from 12 to 9 was that “discount” people were talking about.

  • CircleLimit4

    I agree we should play hardball, I just can’t blame Lee for taking a few pitches.

    I also have serious doubts that Lee left 4/38 on the table unless that offer involved a S&T in a market he had absolutely no interest in.

  • Mucha

    For some reason I never believed in Lee’s absolute willingness to stay in NY and play here for a discount, he tried way too much to be popular. I guess I have the instinct of a Raptor.

    Like I said, I think Donnie Walsh has to resolve David Lee’s situation this summer. He should either stay patient and offer $7 to $7.5 million (per year) at the end of the summer or try to sign-and-trade him for Rudy Fernandez if Pritchard is willing to reconsider a Fernandez deal. If Lee signs a one-year deal he’ll have to play with Curry, Hill and Milicic and I think that’d hurt his numbers and his financial value – it wouldn’t be a smart decision from Lee’s perspective in my opinion.

  • CircleLimit4

    I would love to wrestle Fernandez away from the Blazers, I wonder if the interest in Lee has increased or decreased with cementing Roy in that blockbuster deal, will they bother to try to resign Aldridge after this season or would they get Lee this year and go for the gold this year?

  • BiggieSmalls

    lets review what we know.

    Lee’s agent asked for 10 mil per BEFORE his RFA year and was told to play the year out by DW

    At the start of his RFA procedd Lee’s agent started the looking for 12 mil per year.

    Paul millsap signed for 4 years 32 mil (8 per)

    Lamar Odom signed for 4 years 33 mil

    Ron Artest signed with LAL for 3 years 18 mil(Full MLE starting at 5.8)

    Ariza signs for 5 years 34 mil (Full MLE)

    So how can 9 mil be fair for Lee? Lee should be taking a DISCOUNT from the 9 million number which is ridiculous. 8 mil would be the market rate.. 6.5 would be a nice “NYC sushi” discount.

    That he is looking for 12 can only be put on him as unrealistic in the market.

  • CircleLimit4

    I just wanna put the disclaimer out there that I don’t think Lee is worth 12mil, I don’t think he’s worth 9 million. I just don’t think we should be surprised that an agent would overvalue his client.

    1. At the end of the year when Lee finished with the most double-doubles did you really think Lee’s agent was going to come down from 10 million? The way they see it, they showed that Lee can play a full year at a high level. Of course they would up the ante.

    2. I figure Lee legitimately thought he could rake in $9-11mil per. He came into the RFA highballing it at 12. Maybe it was unrealistic but I’m sure his agent filled his head with the numbers players like Okafor, Dalembert and Dampier are making. Overpaying for big men is common practice in this league.

    3. Milsap, Odom and Artest all got their contracts after Lee asked for 12, that could be chalked up to underestimating the market. And arguably, Artest and Odom took discounts to play for the defending champs.

    4. Again I don’t think Lee should get 9. Conversely, I think 6.5 would have been laughed as a discount before the RFA market opened up.

    Hindsight is 20/20. This offseason has been a strange one and no one though Lee would be without an offer in August. Lee and Bartlestein were aiming high in June and it’s been whittled down to plain stubborn now.

    The 12mil figure is ancient news at this point. I seriously doubt Lee is still looking for 12 or even 10 million. Now I think he’s holding out for 8 mil. Again, I’m not sure how much I believe this 4yr/$38mil offer. If he did reject such an offer this late in the game, then he’s stupid or greedy or maybe there was a catch. Maybe it sent him to a tiny market he had no interest in, or maybe there was something shady in the contract like team option in the second year. Honestly, I don’t think the Knicks wanna make Lee an offer until they solve the PG sitch.

    Regardless, I don’t blame Lee for going for the gold in July. It’s a business, and he was milking a career year for all it’s work. But the lack of offers, big or small, is puzzling in August.

  • Myles A. Mills

    my view on David Lee has changed a lot. Honestly, and it sounds foolish, but ever since he started wearing that shooter’s sleeve I knew he had changed a little.

  • italian stallion

    I’m in the camp that thinks Lee is overvaluing himself, but I think Walsh is also screwing up by not being flexible enough with the 2010 plan.

    I like idea of getting and maintaining cap flexibility, but we have to be realistic. We aren’t going to move Jeffries or Curry unless we give something up we can’t afford to give up if we want to be a decent team this year.

    I think we should sign Robinson for 1 year and Lee/Sessions for multiple years and worry about the cap issues later. There is nothing wrong with signing one good player next year and another in 2010. We can’t allow this James PIPE DREAM to screw us up. He is NOT coming here. I am close to 100% sure about that. It’s about 90% he stays with the Cav and somewhere between 5% and 10% he goes to Miami, NY, or somewhere else. I make the Knicks chances about 2%.

  • Chris Alvino

    Haha…Yeah, what was that about? The gritty, old school tough guys never wore those shooter sleeves..

    Those things are just an accessories. Remember those tights that players used to wear? Those were a joke too. Kind of like Wade’s band-aid.

  • Chris Alvino
  • BiggieSmalls

    I expected Lee to hold true to what he said all year..

    That he would sign in NY for a discount because this is where he wants to be

    The original point of my post..

    That he is not following thru on those statements mean he should be called out on it. And I feel that Chris didnt do that in the piece..

    I call him out for allegedly letting his agent run rough shod over his wishes. If that is really what is going on.

    Lee is the talent here. If he wanted to sign in NYC he could direct his agent to get him signed, save face and hold true to what he said in the public forum all throughout the year. Or does a players words to his fan base not mean anything anymore/?

    The FACT that he is grossly over valuing himself only makes his previous comment that much worse. And .. again.. where are the writers calling him on the carpet for this dose of reality and past statements?

  • paulempson

    Lee needs to recognize that , at this point, he is starting to look bad. Nate see’s no one is offering hm the deal that he wants , also respects what DW is doing in regards to next summer and has seen that w/out that a culture of losing will just continue.

    If Lee did turn down the initial offer . He is nuts. If he doesnt take a 7 mil per this year …he is nuts .

    Stick to the plan at all costs and get the FA’s that are out there that WILL improve us in that particular position.

    I admire Donnie Walsh’s patience and perseverance during this time.

    Camp is just around the corner so something shoyd happen in the next week or so.

    Hopefully

  • CircleLimit4

    I’m sorry you didn’t take those statements with a bigger grain of salt. He would be far from the first athlete to seeming say one thing and do another.

    The truth is Lee and his agent dispelled rumors of a hometown discount way back in June. Again, not surprising.

  • KBT1615

    I really hope we can pull a Lee and Beasley switch or Boozer. Kinda don’t want Lee back anymore…

  • BiggieSmalls

    thats fine. you and the media can accept the lies told to us as par for the course.

    It does not dismiss the need of journalists and fans to call the player and the agent out for the action and not call this a problem with Walsh sticking to a plan and being patient.

    Calling this an overzealous agent issue is missing the true issue here. It is entirely a problem of a player and his agent going back on their previous statements, over valuing their market and making unreasonable demands.

    It’s not about your comments CL4. It’s about the article Chris wrote and the absolute PASS Lee is getting in the media with regard to this situation.

  • CircleLimit4

    I understand why you, as a true Knicks fan, would feel Lee isn’t living up to his word, but I’m sure Lee and his agent don’t feel that’s the case.

    As far as they’re concerned, Lee never promised anything, he simply changed the way he felt about staying in NY. I don’t think he should be given a “pass” no “called-out.” Can’t condemn a guy for changing his mind when it’s his future at stake.

    There are no promises in sports, only contracts.

  • CircleLimit4

    Side note:

    Anyone else creeped out by that look Eddy is giving Lee in that picture?

  • Myles A. Mills

    “Touch me, Dave”

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  • BiggieSmalls

    i think we are seeing from teh comments below that most fans are genuinely upset with this so called “change of mind” for Lee.

    I would just hope the people in the press who get the opportunity to ask the tough questions do just that rather than fluff this all off as a typical off season salary negotiation.

  • CircleLimit4

    I wholly agree on that account. I’m sure there will be numerous questions as to how they arrive at whatever figure they do and why it took so long. The juicy parts might come out if Lee does not end up Knick.

    I’m just as peeved as everyone else that Lee lead us to believe that he’s more eager to be a Knick than he actually is, but he’s looking out for number 1 right now. He’s a basketball player, not Gandhi.

    We don’t have reporters asking us everyday what we’re going to do concerning a hypothetical multi-million dollar contract half a year from now. This may be just be another contract for the Knicks but this upcoming contract will define Lee’s career, he’s not going to rush anything and make decisions based on how he felt 6-8 months earlier when the Knicks were hunting for a playoff spot.

    I’m sorry but you sound like Lee gave the Knicks organization an engagement ring. He did no such thing, not until he signs on the dotted line.

  • CircleLimit4

    Haha! That made my night.

    (insert limo driver joke here)

  • HaS

    Biggie give it up, the media and these new age Knick fans are going to give _avi_ a pass forever. They’ll probably cheer him when he ends up on another team next year or the year after.

    This is exactly why I’m so hard on _avi_ because no matter what he does (lack of defense, taking charges or shot block attempts) or says (frustrated with contract situation and thinks he needs to look at going in another direction because he feels he deserves 10-12 mil a year) he gets a pass.

    Everyone gives Nate a hard time, but Lee escapes criticism for the most part. Only one of the two of them appears to be sincere when saying they’d like to remain a Knick.

    I hate to say it but I can’t help wondering if this is because it’s been so long since the Knicks had a player that looked like the majority of their fan base that was actually a decent? (Travis Knight, Chris Dudley or Keith Van Horn I guess didn’t do it for them.)

    Nah, it can’t be that. People can’t be that superficial can they?

  • HaS

    I’d actually e upset if they signed _avi_ for 4 yrs 38 million, that’s way too much in this market. They’re bidding against themselves! I’d let his ass stay home half the year like they did Marbury or Tinsley, then sign and trade him at the deadline for some picks. LOL that’ll never happen of course. Let him sign an offer sheet somewhere IF any team thinks he’s worth it at this point.

  • Its The Kid

    I dont care if its a 1% chance that Lebron comes here, I’ll take that chance any day over the chance that we make the playoffs with Lee as a 8mil player on this team… Lee has been on this team 4years now and we have averaged 27.5 wins in that time… Knicks fans scream how much they want to win but they dont want to sacrafice… The media is right, you cant rebuild in New York… Because even when a player of Lebrons caliber has expressed he isnt going to sign an extension and will be a FA while we are under the cap, we still want to jeopardize it… We still want to be impatient for the possiblity that David Lee and Sessions could possibly get us to the playoffs… Mind you, these two guys have never made the playoffs… And both of them together at 14mil dont add up to what Lebron is… I’d venture to say that with Lebron and no Lee or Sessions and a few stumble bums we have a better chance of making the playoffs… Take a look at the Cavs team that played for a championship, they arent much better than the 6 players we would have left if James came here… Why jeopardize the chance of getting the biggest star this franchise has ever seen to maybe make the playoffs this year… Its shortsided and we need to think bigger, even if its a bit of a dream… As long as Lebron doesnt have an extension the dream lives on… As soon as the cap is jeopardized the dream dies… This town is way too negative… Why gets your hopes up to get let down, so lets just stay worse than mediocre… I dont get it…

  • Dave the Rave

    “Players of a similar elk”???

    I suppose he can run like a deer and take it to the rack.

    Lee should take $8M and be grateful.

    Walsh is quite a poker player. Make Lee squirm.

    Thanks for the peaceful blog.

    DTR

  • italian stallion

    WE all need to put down the crack pipe.

    James and Wade aren’t coming here.

    The plan should be to sign one all star caliber player in 2010 and one in 2011. With those players plus a young core of Lee, Robinson, Gallo, Sessions, Hill, and Douglas we would have a young and improving team that would have a shot at the playoffs this year and more than that going forward. If there are better opportunities or we can make some deals, that’s great. But it is foolish to not consider Lee and Robinson as potentially valuable players going forward. It’s just an issue of assigning a fair value to them and then signing them.

  • Its The Kid

    What else does your crystal ball tell you? You should use it for mega millions instead of sports predictions it will help you alot more in the long run…

    You dont know that Lebron or Wade wont become Knicks… Will it happen maybe not, but without the money available it wont happen… You would rather sacrafice possibly having one of the top 5 players of all time (when its all said and done) for Nate, Lee, and Sessions long term… I rather wait and see… Than listen to you and your psychic friends…

  • bob go knicks

    its players of a similar “ILK” NOT “ELK”

  • knicks2win

    Hpoe that Walsh and Dantoni will come up with a good point guard.

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