Barkley Rips Knicks Management

eh.. Barkley has some valid points but he is all Shock and Awe.. Looking for headlines..

Stick to black jack Sir Charles.

What bothers me most about comments like Barkley is the assumption if we dont sign LeBron or Wade that everything has been for nothing.

Someone noted on an earlier thread, that if we dont sign anyone we have created cap space while focusing on a core of young players that play in the system we have.

Throwing money at the wrong players is worse then not throwing money at so-so players.

So we dont sign LeBron or Wade… we instead sign a 2nd rate player or two, dont kill our cap space, get another top pick do a trade maybe… have more cap space the following season…

CP3 will be a FA in a year or two. Melo is a FA the year after that…

The goal was to get under the cap so you can operate like a real basketball team. DW is going to have that accomplished after 2 years at the helm.

i Meant Melo is a FA next year

the only good use of max cap space is on game changing players..

There are VERY VERY few of them obviously.

I would HATE this to wind up like Detroit this year.. Get big space and drop it all on Charlie Villanueva and Ben Gordon.

Id DW doesnt bag the big game and spends on 2nd rate players I will be VERY dissapointed.

So will most fans and pundits. You dont win the NBA without superstars.

I agree, I am not saying drop it all on 2nd rate players but its nice to be able to sign people and be in the discussion.

I am hoping for the star, but if they all burn us, we dont pack up and go home. We sign a guy or two to help progress the team, use our new draft pick and try to get that superstar the following year.

Rebuilding is a process. DW has a plan and is going for it. If he needs to, I am sure he will go to plan B.

I still think LeBron will sign here. NYC is a special place and very rarely does it open its arms to someone and say… “come own this city, come here and be the King of NY.” Dude wants to pass that up to stay in Cleavland? More power to him.

I read someone on twitter mention that Lebron and the Cavs come to NYC ont he DAY of a potential Yankees ticker tape parade (Nov 6th)

that would cement it IMO

Barkley is a Blowhard! He just loves to rip the knicks. Hes wrong these guys are gonna play their butts off to get new contracts. I would love to get the 8th seed and see what he says about that.

Agreed. Like I have said we will prove doubters wrong this year, this team isn’t as bad as people try to make us seem we are a solid center and a star away from being one of the East’s best.

Since we don’t have a 2010 1st round pick and If Donnie can’t get a star player in 2010, we will be in the same boat if not worse heading into 2011 free agency.

I feel that the development of Gallo, Will, Hill & Douglas is as equally important as is the signing of a 2010 superstar.

Best case scenario – Were competitive (38 to 42 wins) Young guns show their potential, Lee & Nate stay, and at the very least we are able to sign Joe Johnson and/or Bosh or Amare

Worst case scenario – no 2010 lottery, no 2010 superstars, Lee & Nate leave as free agents, and the young guns don’t show enough promise heading into 2011.

The Knicks are just turrble, a bunch of crazy knucklehead… I could beat them at the buffa line AND at the crap table… Just turrble.

i hope this happens, but more likely i think it’s going to be in between eq’s best and worst case scenario. i see us signing Amare, having 2 out of the 4 of douglas, hill, gallo, chandler making great progress, and waiting till the next season’s summer after this to add that second superstar after Curry comes off the books.

I agree that developing our young players is a priority. Trading Jeffries and Curry is a priority. Signing Lee and or Robinson is dicey unless you are talking a one year deal. If you sign Lee and Robinson long term that will eliminate signing a superstar. Three superstars cost at least 45 million. Then you only have 15 for the rest of the team. If we don’t get one or more superstars in 2010, DW will need to continue to be patient and wait for 2011. Meanwhile this team can continue to improve regarding of Barkley’s opinion.

It’s LeBron James or Dwyane Wade or BUST. If we end up with just Joe Johnson as the big FA signing, we failed. And we are right back to 2002 when Allan Houston was our best player and was a mediocre Star with a Max contract. We need a King, not more pawns. If Donnie Walsh cannot sign LeBron or Wade, save the money. Don’t waste it on crap like Johnson or Chris Bosh and kill the cap again for the next 5 years.

I don’t see why JBJ and Wade would come to any team that has no center and power forward–they are not desperate to play on a lame team. This team has some nice role players, and maybe Gallo will become a star, but come on, this is not a team, it’s a buncha powder puffs. No way LBJ or Wade would come here unless the Knix had a star center, and there are none to be had.

As for Barkley, he’s a fun guy and commands a lot of respect, but his grumpy blowhard ways are an embarrassment to TNT and the NBA, not to mention his obesity. He should resign and start running his own b-ball team somewhere. I doubt that he could be the GM for any NBA team–who’d want to back him? Governor Chuck? He’s welcome to try.

DTR

Bosh is not a bad consolation prize. Talented bigs are few and far between and considering Knicks play in league where Troy Murphy makes 11mil and Rashard Lewis makes 18+, I don’t mind giving 12-15 to an 4-time all-star in Bosh.

If the Knicks make the playoffs and Gallinari plays well, then it would rationally be a good decision to sign with the Knicks.

I mean the Cavaliers have no future whatsoever, Mo Williams and Anderson Varejao aren’t significantly better than Nate Robinson and David Lee. At least the Knicks have star potential with Danilo Gallinari who reminds me of Detlef Schrempf, one of the most underrated players of the 90′s (19-9-6 in 1993 which is statistically Pippen-esque). He should leave Cleveland and then come back with more money in the bag when the Cavs have a talented supporting cast (a few lottery picks) to offer.

The only players the Knicks should try to sign are LeBron James, Dwyane Wade and Chris Bosh in my opinion. I’d much rather see Melo wearing a Knicks uniform though.

Chris Bosh is crap? What league are you watching?

CircleLimit4,

What has Chris Bosh done? You aren’t winning a title with Bosh as your best player.

im not a pessimist, but even i don’t think were very close to being one of the easts best.

but then again, ive re-read what you wrote. and yes, a star and a solid center would really put any team among the easts best.

Take our line-up,add a solid enter,and even Lebron……..we are still not as good as the CELTICS or the MAGIC (and if LBJ stays in cleveland we will be even further behind)

bosh is gonna need more than 12-15 mil.CHRIST!DAVID LEE wants 12mil,bosh is looking for more like 17to19

last year 23pts pg and 10 rebs and hes still young ill take bosh and johnson,that takes care of the 2 guard and the center.Alls we need is a PG
C-BOSH
PF-LEE-OR HARRINGTON
SF-GALLO
SG-JOHNSON
PG-?(DOUGLAS?)

we’re not worse off in 2011. Curry and Jeffries will be off by then.
We will have oodle and oodles of cap space.

Does anyone know about the availablity of Chris Paul?
I know he means so much to the city of New Orleans, but he’s got to be pissed that management gives him nothing to work with.

I thought he was a FA in 2011

Imagine Chris Paul running D’Antoni’s offense.
Nash Who ???

i dont think we would be in a worse boat.

our young guys will have an extra year of development.

we will have signed SOMEONE else…

I mean:

No doubt FA:
Joe Johnson
Ray Allen
Manu Ginobili
Marcus Camby
Tracey McGrady
Shaquille O’Neal
Brad Miller
Stephen Jackson
Jermaine O’Neal
Mike Miller
Rip Hamilton

Could Be FA:
Yao Ming (owed 17.7 million in 10/11)
Amare Stoudamire (owed 17.7 million in 10/11)
LeBron James (owed 17.2 million in 10/11)
Dwayne Wade (owed 17.0 million in 10/11)
Chris Bosh (owed 17.1 million in 10/11)
Dirk Nowitzki (owed $21.5 million in 10/11)
Josh Howard (owed $11.8 million in 10/11)
Mike Redd (owed $18.3 million in 10/11)
Tyson Chandler (owed $12.8 million in 10/11)

That is an insane amount of real good players. All of them are going to ignore 7SOL in NYC? No way. Goal A is LBJ. Goal B is Wade… Goal C-J? Could be a bunch of people on there, but the list is long and good.

And while we dont have a Draft pick next year, we could get one in a trade… and we will have them all after that. so we have a 2011 pick to add to the team.

I also dont doubt the idea that LBJ stays the 1 extra year in Cleavland to finish up and let the knicks build for 1 more year. With Curry coming off the books we could sign him the next offseason.

i would love to see Melo in NYC.

I think bosh is highly overrated.
I wouldnt mind him being my number 2 option though.

I think he needs a burly center to protect him a bit though.

I like this comment if only for the fact that Sir Charles is giving us some quotes to light a fire under our players asses. Nothing like someone calling you out and a couple money quotes to put up on the board for team meetings…

I would prefer that DW stand pat next offseason if what all the doubters are saying comes true. If LBJ and D Wade are out and Bosh Amare and Johnson are all expecting max contracts, I don’t make a significant move.

Maybe I sign Joe Johnson to a max because of a glaring hole at the 2 but other than that I can’t justify trying to put together a championship around Bosh or Amare as I see both of them as more 1b type players.

In other words stay the course and wait out 2011 and actually have draft picks and a fairly solid FA crop. This would show me that as an organization they are on the right path to building better teams not just short term but long term as well, which makes for nice contrast from the Layden, IT era…

Not saying I really echo the sentiment “crap like Johnson or Bosh”

But lets be honest can you see Bosh or Johnson putting a young team on their back and bringing us to the promised land the way the east is stacked right now?

Didn’t think so…On that note I do think that they are integral pieces in a potential championship team.

“As for Barkley, he’s a fun guy and commands a lot of respect,
*Shocked by this statement but enticed to continue reading thought*

but his grumpy blowhard ways are an embarrassment to TNT and the NBA, not to mention his obesity.”
*Oh there it is, the balance hence bringing the comment back down to earth and reality*

This is a man who recently got a DUI and made comments about how this is the first time he’s been caught and it’s such a life lesson etc…

Did we all forget that he has also had problems with being a degenerate gambler. This dude would wreck a franchise worse than Zeke IMO.

Anyone have insight on what a max contract would shape up to be with the current guesstimated cap, or does anyone know how the max contract cap is calculate based on cap??

REally, with Chandler coming off the bench and Gallo starting??? I don’t see it…

If you’re looking for ONE player to do all that, of course not. There is not a single player who can do that not named Lebron Kobe or Wade. But to pass on locking up a all-star big man who is going into his prime, would be a backwards step. No one is saying Bosh is going to be our savior, but he’s one of the top 5 big men in the league.

If Lebron and Wade are out grab Bosh, then pick up another piece when Jeffries and Curry expire.

What has Al Jefferson done? What has Brandon Roy done? You gonna call them crap?

I’m not sure where you got this concept that any FA signings have to be our one and only savior. You’re losing track of a team concept. It’s not Chris Bosh’s or Lebron’s or Wade’s job to get us to the Finals, it’s the Knicks job. No one man is supposed to hoist this team. Bosh helps. Having one of the best PF in the league is a nice piece to have, no 2 ways about it. Especially when you see competitors who have pieces like KG, Pau, Lewis, Duncan.

A contract year is great when one player is playing his ass off for a contract.

When you have half, maybe more, of the team trying to show what they’re worth, it becomes trouble.

D’Antoni needs players to buy into his system. To hustle up and down the floor, find the open man, and take the open shot.

D’Antoni had trouble with this towards the end of last year, in the begining of the year everyone was passing, it was beautiful. By the middle of the year, it became a one on one fest. Lots of drives into traffic and taking tough shots.

I just cant really see five guys playing for contracts all willing to buy into this system.

Calm down Bob. I was calculating with Bosh still under his 6th year, my bad. He’ll go into his 8th year in 2010, that means 30% of the cap. Last year that was 17mil and change. But if the cap shrinks more as the NBA expects then a max will be in the 15-17mil range.

And Lee was a different situation. 12mil was an intentional high-ball. You can’t high-ball a max contract.

YEAH! I AGREE with circle,basketball is a team sport,no individual can win a ring by himself

Cleveland has a bright future if JBJ stays. They have a few solid players and Shaq could hang around for years. In an age of almost no centers, he’s valuable at even 1/2 the level he used to play at.

Can anyone explain how the NBA sets its salary cap year by year, and why do they say it is going down?

Seems likely to me that Bosh won’t get over $14M or so and he’ll be lucky to get more than 3 years because the economy is crashing, people are not buying tix like they used to and TV ad revenues and everything are coming down and GMs are feeling it. I would not give Bosh more than $12M for 3 years. Only an LBJ and KB will get a king’s ransom. The days of insane contracts are numbered. DW is wise to build young and not get suckered into signing mediocre players for over $4M.

DTR

yea, it’s amazing how much the clamor for sessions has died down (with the way he’s stunked up in the preseason). we really have to pay for the right players, we’ve had too much of bad spending under isaiah.

Melo belongs in NY. It would have happened too if Billups didn’t go and fix things up there chemistry wise.

I would try really hard to flip Chandler for Rubio. Especially if Chandler improves, the Wolves would be a lot more open to trading him.

But this hinges on us getting those other position players, which I still view as a long shot.

I can’t find the article, but I think the NBA’s salary cap is part determined by the economy – so when the economy struggles so does the overall salary cap.

And Bosh is not going to settle for 12 mil a year. Not when everyone who pursues him will be offering max deals.

12 mil / year is ben gordon level man! (11 /y)

“Cleveland has a bright future if JBJ stays”

Well obviously, but his teammates are not particularly talented (Mo Williams is a third option and Anderson Varejao is a role player), they will not get a lottery pick any time soon and they won’t have enough capspace to sign another max free agent next summer. By the way Shaq 37 years old, his career is almost over.

“Seems likely to me that Bosh won’t get over $14M or so and he’ll be lucky to get more than 3 years because the economy is crashing, people are not buying tix like they used to and TV ad revenues and everything are coming down and GMs are feeling it”

People overrate the impact of the recession in my opinion. $14 million??? Joe Johnson TURNED DOWN a 4year/$60 million extension offer. Chris Bosh WILL get a max contract, believe me. Hopefully he’ll sign with the Knicks – I mean he’s already a star and he’s still a young player – can’t get much better than that (except Dwyane Wade and LeBron James).

If we can’t get LBJ or Wade, I would be ecstatic to come away with Bosh and Johnson.

Bosh is an elite player (top 10 to 12)and will be only 26 next summer. Johnson is a star, one tier below superstar status, working in a weak media market, knows D’s system and fills a big need at the 2. He will not cost max money, but will get 12 -14M. Might take a little discount to play in a huge media market like NY (endorsements will more than make up for any discount), especially after being overlooked by so many in Atlanta. Bob, you’ve been on target all week, trumpeting Johnson’s assets.

Assuming the cap is around 55M, that we rid our books of JJ, then that will leave us with about 34-35M to spend, plus the MLE. Bosh and Johnson will cost probably around 30M, leaving 4-5M and the MLE. An upgrade at pg would be nice.

We will still have Curry’s salary in 2011, and hopefully a more generous cap, to complete the team.

While everyone expects Gallo to shine, I think Will may make the greater progress over last year. His terrific work ethic and all around play, will allow his game to blossom this year, in my opinion.

Agree CL4.

jfried,

Johnson and Bosh together can certainly shoulder the load. Would make a championship caliber tandem to build around. Even with LBJ, we would need additional pieces. That can come in 2011.

Johnson is very underrated on this board. Besides being a 20+ scorer, he is a good passer, has the speed and athleticism to excel in this system, and he is a excellent defender.

Again, I would take this consolation prize in a minute, if available.

He commands a lot of respect and is an embarrassment to the NBA. Is that not incongruous?

Unless you meant he commands respect in the casinos. Though his money commands respect there, not necessarily him.

Mucha,

I’m glad you added Bosh to your list.

You wouldn’t consider adding Joe Johnson or even Josh Howard, to the knicks? Either will cost less than max. You need to start building with solid, if not spectacular, players. Then look for your superstar in 2011.

I think Gallo and Will both have to perform well in order to attract top free agents.

Agree about he Cavs and their future. They are locked into a lot of money for 2010 and bad contracts in Varejao, and to a lesser extent, Mo, beyond 2010. Any team with LBJ is not going to have a lottery pick unless they can trade for one, so that avenue is unavailable. They have little cap room to improve, while the Knicks will have plenty left over after signing LBJ. If he doesn’t win this year, Cavs are not likely to improve next year.

I’m with you all the way Bob. Though we disagree on Hill’s potential. I think he will be much improved by 2010. A bench with Hill, Chandler and Toney plus one more player, sounds like a nice complement.

jho,

Depending on what Will does this year and next, I, too, would trade Chandler for Rubio (I assume you understand that he won’t be available until 2011). I dont think that the Rubio trade will ever come to fruition though.

Last year they had no floor leader, and it showed. If Harrington becomes that leader, as he feels it’s his responsibility to do so, they will be a much more disciplined team as a whole.

The salary cap is set, based on a percentage of the previous year’s total revenues.

They say it is going down “because the economy is crashing, people are not buying tix like they used to and TV ad revenues and everything are coming down” and the cap will reflect that. Hopefully, it has hit bottom and is not still crashing.

The NBA’s guidance (50M) is nothing but a wild guess or purposeful deception. Predicting what this economy will look like by the end of the NBA season is like predicting the weather for for that final game. In reality though, we can say that the economy and people’s spending habits will be lower than it is this year, for the reason you stated.

A max contract is based on time served in the NBA (no Euroleague credit) and the current salay cap in place July 1st of each year. For a player with 7 years experience, as most opt out free agents are, it is 30% of the team’s cap; 10 years or more, 35%. That means that a max for 7yr. players will be 15M if the cap is 50M, 16.5M if the cap is 55M, etc.

Bosh is guaranteed 17.1M in salary for 2010/11. So if his agent believes that he will be offered no more than 14M, and they will know beforehand (wink, wink), he will remain a Raptor for one more year and try his hand at free agency in 2011, when he becomes a true free agent (unless he signs an extension).

Bosh will be offered the max by more than several teams. He is a top player and, bad economy or not, there will be money for stars. He will also get max years.

DW was wise and refused to sign mediocre players for $4M. He will set a foundation with young players, but he will build the team by acquiring several stars via free agency. He has already stated that and his plan is based on that. He may make a significant trade or two as well.

Finally, Cleveland has a bleak future without LBJ. That is why they are doing everything they can to keep him there. It will be years (and a drastic reduction in revenues) before they can put together a playoff team without him, if at all.

Correctly stated, ANY TEAM THAT HAS LEBRON, HAS A BRIGHT FUTURE!

always liked barkley he was my favorite player back then
he keeps it real..

anything over 12 mill is over paying BOSH JOE JOHN AN AMRE.

I really like your plan dw over jfried’s.

And if we struck out on Lebron and Wade, the only max player I would want to sign is Bosh or Amare. It’s a lot easier getting that elite wing player than an elite big man. How many elite big men you see reaching free agency like it will this coming summer?

I didn’t mention Joe Johnson because I was talking about max contract offers. He’s not young enough to get one at this stage of his career.

You want to sign JJ in order to attract Melo in 2011? Why not (I’d love it), but the Nuggets have a young talented supporting cast to offer as well (JR Smith, Ty Lawson etc). Paradoxically, LeBron James is more attainable in my opinion.

Yes, I was thinking he once was respected in the media by some. Scratch what I wrote, you guys are right, he has some major image probs in more than one regard. He looked pretty pathetic tonight, weight-wise.

Josh Howard, no. Knix already have Gallo, Harrington and Chandler for small forward. They need bigs for rebounding. Josh Smith is my choice. Where was Howard in the clutch last year? Anyone know why he was out tonight?

Thanx