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The team can’t compete right now, players are not on the same page and for fans, yes, it can get worse. You all know what I mean when I say “Utah Jazz.”
In case you needed a reminder.
“…Scott Layden - The former Knicks GM was replaced by Isiah. Layden was working on a Marbury deal in the weeks before he was canned. Isiah swooped in and sweetened the deal for Phoenix with a couple of first round picks, one of which eventually was traded to Utah where Layden now works…”
“…The Knicks could equal the franchise’s worst nine-game start (1-8) with two more losses. Compare that to last season’s 6-3 start after which Walsh made his two cap-clearing trades and shot to death the next two seasons.
After the Jazz, the Knicks host the rising Hawks, who boast Jamal Crawford, sacrificed in last November’s bloody cap-clearing massacre.
It must have killed D’Antoni to see rookie Bucks point guard Brandon Jennings look so much quicker, and so much more fluid than Duhon on Saturday. It must kill D’Antoni to read Jennings say how badly he wanted to be drafted by the Knicks, how badly he wanted to play for D’Antoni, how he and LeBron James would make the perfect tandem one day.
D’Antoni does not run the draft — he is one voice among many. D’Antoni won’t give his true assessment on whether he had Jennings higher than Jordan Hill on his personal list.
But know this: The Knicks scouts didn’t have Jennings close to Hill on their board. The club’s European scout Kevin Wilson liked Jennings, but did not push Walsh hard enough. The Barcelona-based Wilson, close to the Ricky Rubio family, probably thinks Rubio will land in New York eventually. Jennings played limitedly last season in Italy…”
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you cant sweat this lost draft pick .. It will drive you crazy. Its water under the bridge.
The Knicks have it in their hands to give Utah the worst possible selection. I dont buy that shipping out Crawford and Randolph immediately meant that the next two years were throw aways.. I would have thought there were additional moves to be made to make this team more competitive. But nothing of substance was done. So we are what we are. Not improved and with at least 7 players on the roster who wont be back next year.
Donnie should be burning up the lines to get something done. Unfortunately, most deals will have to wait until Dec 15th when contracts just signed can be traded.
If the Knicks had their 1st rounder next year I wouldn’t care at all how they fared in the W-L column this year. The fact they don’t have a pick is a depressing reminder for me everyday.
Amen brother.
All I know is we needed a D’Antoni style point guard in the worst way and they draft a project, J. Hill, in the 8th spot. Bad management leads to bad coaching leads to bad play. And because of the LeBron 2010 hoopla, the team is bitter and apathetic and it shows.
After Duhon made that comment about the team not taking games serious enough, he’s become invisible. There’s talk about Harrington and others being pissed at him. D’Antoni has just about lost the team. And it’s only November.
Why don’t we just FF to July 2010.
I wasn’t astounded by Jennings when he played us at all. He seems good for his age, and it sort of broke my heart to hear him talk about how he wanted to play for NY, but I’m not demoralized by not selecting him. It does seem to me that it was a mistake to pass on him, but it’s one I can like with, especially if J-Hill and TD turn into solid players.
live with*
Tommy are you on the knicks payroll, your always protecting them dam..
The Crawford-Randolph trades depleted talent but were supposed to make the Knicks more of a team. Harrington was suppose to make up for Craw’s scoring (which he has done) and play better defense. Mobley was supposed to fill the hole at the two. Trading Zach was supposed to open up the middle for Curry and help to increase our ball movement. The reason we now look at those trades as gutting the talent on the roster is because Mobley had to retire and Curry is a waste of air. Its really not fair to say DW was throwing the next two seasons away . . . That being said DWs insistence on putting this thing in Duhon’s hands is mindboggling. Arroyo, Pargo there were plenty of PGs he could have signed for one year. He didn’t have to sign sessions, but we could have gotten a better PG than Duhon or at least someone to split minutes with him.
I’ll just keep it going. Amen Brother.
Is MrFurious Hulk Hogan? “Amen Brother” lol
No shots.
first of all ,Walsh knew that MObley was hurt,plus he has had an entire year to make up for it.we still have no point guard and we still dont have a two.plus it doesnt matter who we bring in at center cuz Dantoni will just put Lee there anyway.Sometimes you have to adapt your system to match the players that you have,and Mike D.is too stubborn to do so
Well said.
If they lose two more games, I’m going to be a Warrior fan, for the remainder of this year! They play real speed ball. Although they’re losing too, they play hard, and are fun to watch! Hint Hint..Knicks! Im telling you right now, if the Knicks dont get it together, the Warriors will run the Knicks out of the Garden this friday. They put up numbers in bunches, and they run off misses and makes, YOU BETTER BE IN SHAPE FOR THESE GUYS!
Can we trade for Anthony Randolph please! He’s a future all-star waiting for his chance! I’d give up Chandler for him in a heartbeat.
The guy can ball. He can play the 3, 4 and 5. Very versatile, handles the ball really well, shoots pretty good, attacks the basket and he blocks shots. Give up Darko or Chandler.
Sorry, but what exactly do we have on our current roster that would entice GS to trade us Randolph (and I finish this sentence with a “.” and not a “?” because this is not meant for u to respond to just think on it). Cause it damn sure won’t be for Darko or Ill Will straight up, and last I checked we don’t have a 1st or 2nd rounder…
I thought we had multiple second rounders ours plus the Balkman trade.
Could be mistaken but I was under the impression we traded our only pick next year (2nd rounder) to LAL in exchange for T Douglass..
what about David Lee, Nate and JJ for Stephen Jackson and Randolph?
What’s the incentive here they would be taking 2 players who are UFAs at the end of this year and JJ.. Really? For a potential all star and a player who is a sometimes bonafide scorer/one of the few vets on their team (as disgruntled as he may currently be).
I can’t see it.
Bro, they don’t even use Randolph like they should, it looks like they would let him go for any one. Chandler is a good fit over there, why wouldn’t they take him?
Nelson doesn’t like Randolph but lets’ be serious, he’s not crazy enough to trade him for Wilson Chandler. He knows that Randolph has lot of potential.
Lee would never accept a trade to the Warriors. Maybe I’m wrong but if Lee is traded he gives up his bird rights so I don’t think he would do it for a losing team, only a playoff team.
“Lee would never accept a trade to the Warriors.”
I think he should, it would be a perfect move for him, as long as Don Nelson is there he would never have to worry about playing defense and he won’t have true NY fans on his back that won’t accept anything less.
I think if Brandon Jennings wins ROY and LeBron James comes out and says I’d love to play with a young PG like that” Tommy Dee will counter with “Doesn’t matter. Rubio was the target.”
To answer your question, I’ve been following Brandon Jennings closely for the past 2 years. First time I ever heard his name was around the 2008 NBA Draft when all this controversy started about him not passing the SAT’s and threatening to go to Europe.
I never dreamed he’d do it.
Then I saw him in the brilliant documentary Gunnin’ For That # ! Spot, which focused on him and a few other high school stars trying to make it to the NBA, culiminating with a game at the Rucker.
I was extremely impressed with the way Jennings carried himself. I was even more impressed, when they showed how he was living in Compton CA, and hadn’t let his surroundings bring him down. In order to make it out of a place like Compton while being raised by a single parent, you need to be mentally tough and focused. That was Brandon Jennings.
He must’ve been 16 at the time, but just carried himself like a young man. He talked about how he wanted to play at the Rucker game in NYC, to make a name for himself, and he did just that. He shined among a group of future NBA players like Kevin Love, Tyreke Evans, Donte Greene, Michael Beasley, J.J. Hickson, etc.
During the game, some of the passes he was making, literally made me fall out of my seat. The kid had amazing court vision. The fact that he was by far the smallest, skinniest player on the court, didn’t seem to matter.
He won the MVP trophy at the end of the game, and was officially on my radar.
I was so impressed I literally sat through the movie in the theater twice. Back to back.
Then a few months later it was announced that he would go play in Italy for a year. And thanks to NBA TV, and ESPN 360, I was able to watch about 10 of his games last year. I saw a kid who was undersized, and struggled at first, but got better every time I saw him. Nobody could stay in front of him, and as the weeks went on, even though he was playing with guys literally twice his size, the kid didn’t back down from anyone.
Even though he never got regular minutes, and his role on the team changed from week to week, the kid never stopped working. I remember one game, where he had something like 9 steals.
Then I remember several games where he’d penetrate and feed his teammates for wide open dunks/shots and they’d blow them. I thought man, an NBA big man would’ve converted that.
He didn’t play alot towards the end of the season, so I had to rely on what I read from Draft Express, and was blown away when I read this article back in May.
http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Brandon-Jennings-1114/
Then he got yet another great write up from Chad Ford where he said Jennings was working tirelessly with one of the best/most respected assistant coaches in Europe.
Does that answer your question Mr. Dee? I didn’t just jump on the Brandon Jennings bandwagon after watching some YouTube videos like everyone else. I’ve been monitoring this kid for a while.
Doesn’t matter, Rubio was the target
So out of curiosity if we gave up Chandler + the 8 pick to the wiz to select rubio, do you think we’d be better right now? Or to take it to another potentially more important plane of thought more attractive to upper echelon FAs come July ‘10??
i think so on both accounts..
We’ve all seen how putrid Duhon is and the future Championship starting PG is NOT on this roster. We’ll need to get a real PG next year as we stand now that is a big hole.
Lebron isnt a point guard
Lebron’s not a point guard but I think if you have him on the floor you can run two combo guards or even shooting guards out there.
The Knicks would have picked Curry with the 5th pick.
I would agree with this. I truly believe that although Rubio could be the real deal and the next coming of Nash (can’t believe I’m saying this, but with better court vision and more creative), he is all things considered a project, and I don’t believe he could come to NYC and do anything more than what Douglas is doing for us right now (except he would contribute offensively whereas Douglas contributes more on D).
As i’ve said, if you feel the need to make this about me, fine. I liked jennings, only saw him live when he was at Oak Hill. I was sure Rubio was the guy, turns out it was Curry then Hill. I’m okay about being wrong, unfortunately I don’t have the luxury of making anonymous comments LOL.
In all seriousness GUY do you think it would make sense for knicks scouts, or all NBA scouts for that matter, to be in attendance at Rucker? They play less D there than the Knicks do.
Since you were so impressed and sold by his on court play, do you think the NBA scouts should pay more attention to Rucker Park, a legendary home of NYC basketball?
I’m just disappointed that you’ve been taking shots at Jennings instead of admitting that a) The kid can play and b) Alot of people including the Knicks and this blog were wrong about him.
It’s not about the Rucker so much as it’s about how he played against the best players in his age group and dominated. Not just there but on the AAU circuit, at Oak Hill, at all the Jordan, Addidas camps, etc.
It’s about how his peers all say they love playing with him. Ask Kevin Love or anyone else who played with him back then. There’s a reason for that. He makes other people better, by getting them the ball at the right time for an easy basket.
Who wouldn’t want to play with a PG like that.
If I’m a GM, I’d at the very least find out all I can about someone like this before I pass on him. It’s inexcusable that Donnie Walsh can say something like “We didn’t have a great feel for his game.”
Huh? Isn’t that your job to scout all the players who can help your team win? And to add insult to injury, he completely dominated Chris Duhon on Saturday, by doing exactly what the Knicks needed Duhon to do, which is pushing the tempo and making his teammates better.
Inexcusable. Donnie Walsh does not get a pass on this one.
I don’t take shots at jennings….i’m saying it’s too early on hill. You’re reading what you want to read.
Explain to me the rational why jennings skipped a workout when teams flew over to see him.
That’s pretty ballsy for a kid with a questionable rep as it was.
and he did have one, that’s fact and not me saying otherwise.
I explained it another thread last week. He was homesick.
He wasn’t playing regular minutes all season, especially during the last month where he got a few DNP -CDs. He was left off the team’s playoff roster, so after watching his team get bumped in the first round, while on the bench, he had to decide between staying in Europe for another 2 weeks and playing at the Reebok Eurocamp, or going home. Had he dominated at the camp in Treviso, there were probably going to be people saying, well he’s SUPPOSED to dominate these guys, but how does he rank vs. the guys in the draft?
So he went home, prepared for the draft, and worked out vs. his peers in the draft. Jonny Flynn, Tyreke Evans, Stephen Curry, etc.
So it’s not like he just blew the workout off like you keep implying. This is what I mean, you keep skewing the facts, because he wasn’t your guy.
He did blow off a workout…home sick? come on that’s apologetic. we’re talking about his CAREER HERE.
and again, you can make this about me all you want, he wasn’t about 15 executive’s “guy” either.
Fact.
He does tend to do that. I don’t think Tommy does it purposely, sometimes you have to point it out to him when he’s doing it.
Do what?
Gunnin’ For That # 1 Spot is a great docu (for those who haven’t seen it rent it or if you have netflix instant queue its on there) and put me on to B Jennings to begin with.
I definitely echo some of your sentiments about how he handled himself in the movie and the level he played at with all that talent around him, however I think you either overlooked part of the underlying message from it or chose not to touch on it to prove your point better. These kids from like 11-12 years old are conditioned by NBA level ad execs, brand reps and trainers to take all the the correct steps to be NBA ready from that age onward. If you don’t believe that he and the other kids in that movie aren’t more or less being coached to act and present themselves in a certain way (especially on camera) to prevent hurting their draft stock and hype surrounding them then you missed a significant undertone in the movie…
That said it was apparent in the film that he is a great talent and that he is very very very capable of running the NBA point, but even then it was fairly apparent that he was a little bit headier than the rest of the pack (except Beasley cause Beasley is a straight up sociopath…)
I’d offer Jordan Hill and Wilson Chandler for Anthony Randolph RIGHT NOW considering that Randolph is in Nellie’s doghouse.
And if I had the opportunity to re-do the draft I’d pick Jennings, but I wanted Tyreke Evans or Stephen Curry – the fact that we couldn’t get them was heartbreaking (Evans will be a poor man’s Dwyane Wade I always said it). I didn’t like Jennings’ attitude, I thought he had “bust” written all over him and I understand Donnie Walsh’s decision. But he was wrong, so was I.
I like Jordan Hill though. But he shouldn’t take long jumpers I mean he’s obviously not a jumpshooter. He has to play in the post, period.
Anyways there are only 2 can’t-miss prospects the Knicks will regret : John Wall and Willie Warren.
I think it’ll be a solid draft but not a spectacular one (a la 2003 or 2008). Derrick Favors looks like a stud but we won’t need another forward and Jordan Hill outplayed Cole Aldrich last year (23 points 11 rebounds). I think it’s all about Wall and Warren from the Knicks’ perspective.
The Knicks will win the lottery this time though. It is so predictable.
You can’t say there’s only 2 can’t miss prospects this early. Aren’t you the same guy who said Terrence Williams can’t play PG?
Maybe Williams will be a good shooting guard with a good ability to create opportunities for his teammates a la Iguodala but he’ll never be a quality point guard in my opinion. Maybe time will prove me wrong!
Why can’t I say that there are two can’t miss prospects FROM THE KNICKS PERSPECTIVE this early? Willie Warren was one of my favorite college players last year (he was just a freshman) and he’s a combo guard – the Knicks need one. And many people believe that John Wall will be better than Derrick Rose.
This draft will be stacked with power forwards, it’s not a guard-heavy draft. But the Knicks need a talented point/combo guard, Warren and Wall fit the bill. That’s it.
Yes Tommy, tonite is the 3rd game of what I’ve been caling our “Nightmare Trilogy” … we play the team that has our lottery pick, after losing to the PG we s/h picked, preceeded by the FA we’ll never get . It’s kinda like last year’s “Dream Week” when the Knicks touted 3 straight games at MSG against the Celts, Kobe, and LBJ … oh, that wound up being a nightmare trilogy too.
Anyway … let’s NEVER forget that, as GM, Layden screwed up the Knicks long term way more than Isaiah. Trading Camby AND the rights to Nene for McDyess put the team in a horrible hole for years. Remember, Layden also passed on Amare … so they could have had Amare or Nene along with Camby up front .. instead, they had McDyess …until his knee blew out again in pre-season. What a WONDERFUL deal!
And, it’s interesting how everybody wants Randolph now … remember he could have been taken instead of Gallo. I say hold off on trying to get him till we see what J-Hill has. If Gallo stays healthy (BIG IF) & Hill develops a bit, they could be formidible frontcourt guys. Not as formidible & Camby & Amare though. As far as next year’s draft, I say package the 2nd round pick (probably one of the 1st 5 in that round) and whoever’s left between Curry or Jeffries plus cash for a servicable vet and a mid 1st rounder.
Either that, or furn over all scouting to The_Guy who obviously had more insite on Jennings & what the Knicks s/h done once their plans A & B (Steph Curry & Rubio) were gone. PS, saw a bit of Rubio on NBATV this weekend .. he looks kinda frail, can’t get over picks, and loses his man defensively pretty consistently … sounds like a perfect fit for D’Ants crew!
Man,i wonder if all of the players playing under D’antoni right now,would still want to play under him next year,or has all of that “shine” begun to have worn off? he doesnt seem like such the great players coach anymore.Maybe he just lets the players do whatever the hell they want,and you just have to have the right combo of uys to make it work.the way KOBE and MJ make Phil Jackson look like a great coach
You can’t let players who haven’t been great or accomplished anything, do what they want! Thats the problem. It shows on the court, a bunch of guys that are lazy, and lethargic. How does your captain say ” I just didn’t make the effort”. Someone pass me my Cell phone so I can give Iverson a call. Guys like the Redeem Team, you don’t have to say much too. Just say ” Lets get a Win!” and its done!
@ bockersorbriefs – lol thanks dude. Tell Donnie Walsh to gimme a call. I also saw the Ricky Rubio game that was on NBA TV this past Saturday.
I was not impressed at all. If anyone wants to see him play again, they’re showing another one of his games this coming Saturday @ 1pm on NBA TV.
I’m sure rubio would hold his own at Rucker…
LOL okay bock, I’ll mention to Walsh that I have a guy called The_Guy (don’t really know his name obviously) who would have drafted jennings.
I’m sure he’d want to hear after the facts.
Why is everyone losing faith in Jordan Hill? It takes big men WAY more time to develop than guards and quite frankly it is a lot harder to find a good big men than a good pg… I am 100 percent for the pick. Yes, Jennings is good, real good but IMO with given time Jordan Hill will be a stud. Roy Hibbert looked horrendous last year, but this year he looked so much better. Please do not criticize Jordan Hill before the kid even gets a chance to DEVELOP, something us new yorkers really cant grasp is that people need time to develop, especially big men.
He will be a good player… if D’Antoni doesn’t want him to become a perimeter player.
Tommy you been saying since preseason this team has a different look, and they are worst than Isiah teams, an the coaching is horrible why does Dantoni always get a pass? he is a bad coach, I don’t care what anyone says he needs allstars to look good, a good coach adjusts to his team not does not make his team adjust to him..
Isiah couldn’t coach HIS PLAYERS so this isn’t about Isiah vs D’antoni.
Phil Jackson would be a bad coach here too. So would riley.
Maybe someone would light a fire under them and question their manhood and professionalism. Mike’s not like that, it doesn’t make any sense when EVERYONE KNOWS THIS IS ABOUT 2010.
The players on this roster should be able to figure it out amongst themselves.
AnotherDantoni, supporter ,come on the guy looks lost, he has alot to do with it, disses Marbury to justify getting Duhon, and it backfired..
Does not coach defense, does not hire a defensive coach with the can go on and on, remember he as garbage in denver too!
Answer this! How many coaches are we gonna go through?
Don Chaney ‘03
Lenny Wilkins ‘04
Larry Brown ‘05
Isiah Thomas ‘06-’07
When will you hold management accountable for acquiring below average players, with recognizable names? Its us the fans, we’re letting them get over. We got excited when we heard the names:
Chris Wilcox
Larry Hughes
Al Harrington
Stephon Marbury!
I will no longer accept mediocrity!
Not that it would change anything but who do you hire if you fired D’antoni.
and don’t say avery johnson. Talk about a guy who fell into talent.
How did doc rivers do before the big 3? Oh yeah, coach of the year injured stars and ZERO with Paul Pierce.
now he’s a championship mind.
How many wins is Phil jackson getting here with this group.
Again, if they are 1-7 out of the gate next year then you are all right and i’d agree with all of you then.
Next…
yeah tommy! my favortie will always be van gundy but i do like mike a lot. i just cant stand the fact that he laughed when we were getting killed.
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