Hill’s Work Ethic Wasn’t a Problem

best line from Vescey in rsponse to the not playing “bad rookie” comment..

“That’s right, Mike, but you have no problem playing bad veterans.”

Im glad we have the NY press to hold the feet of the coaches and GMs to the fire..

The Hill questioning is Fair.. in light of what Darko is doing in Minny after not seeing the light of the day from this “coach’s” dog house..

Unfortunately we can not move on because this coach is still in charge of the minutes and there valid questions about what has gone on her the past 20 months.. irrespective of the talent.

“Now, we can we all move on?”

Nope. We traded the # 8 pick for cap space. If he turns into a star or we don’t land a premium free agent it will be news for at least five more years.

“My guess? Donnie Walsh was always planning to deal the first pick to move Jeffries if there were no takers for him otherwise.”

That is the impression that I had from the middle of the season when he was playing hard, and they sat him down. I always felt they were trying to keep him from developing a following with the fans to keep the backlash to a minimum when they traded him. The only problem I have with “moving on” is that we still need two big men next year, and if we get one that’s better than Hill, it’s going to take the money we saved on Jeffries. So that money still doesn’t go to the “two max player fund”. And we still will only have one big man!!! I also have a problem moving on because if that was the reason… why not say so? Why blame the “bad rookie”.

Well, I’m happy for the bad rookie comment. I wanted Hill last year and I think he’s going to be one of the most effective big men in the NBA in another 3 years. That comment probably ensured him getting over the hump.

Such a bad situation. It is going to be impossible to move on from this as its obviously a huge deal. Vecsey said it best as Biggie just said. Just beyond crazy that he couldn’t get minutes and then that the coach acts completely immature and criticizes him for no reason. Thats ridiculous. If Jordan Hill turns into a good player, we better spend all that money this year and be a very good team the next few years.

I just don’t how come at the beginning of the season Hill was a guy that “definitely a part of the future” and Walsh was “really impressed with his game” to “Donnie Walsh was always planning to deal the first pick to move Jeffries if there were no takers for him otherwise”.

It sucks we had to give up Hill. I predict he will be a good player in this league and on the right team a very valuable role player. At least as good as Udonis Haslem.

If we end up getting LBJ and/or Bosh and another blue chip FA it becomes a non-issue. While Jeffries and Hill on the team add some depth up front, would you be willing to trade both of them together for Bosh? For Joe Johnson? I would have to take that deal, and that is basically what Walsh had to consider here.

It’s all about LBJ; well, primarily about him. Do you think LBJ would prefer to join a Knicks team with Jeffries and Hill or one in which he could handpick his running mate(s)? I have to think the latter, and this is what it is all about.
If we lose out on LBJ we still have a chance to be quite good if we are smart about which pieces we get and how we leverage Curry’s contract, but we will not be great. After so many years of sucking and at best mediocrity, I’m for going for the brass ring.

I’m hoping LBJ is following what Douglas and Gallinari are currently doing. With these two AND Chandler, and a bench with Walker, Giddens, and possibly T-Mac (if he signs for the vet minimum) there are the complimentary pieces to challenge the Magic, Boston, and Atlantas of the division. I leave the Cav’s out because if LBJ leaves they are in the lottery.

Douglas
LBJ
Chandler
Gallinari
Bosh

Damn – These guys could go deep.
If you could parlay Curry’s contract into an even better PG than you are going to the big dance. Douglas and/or Chandler would make for a great 6th man off the bench.

Above average PG
Douglas
LBJ
Gallinari
Bosh

If we get these guys it doesn’t matter that we gave up Hill, although he’d be great to have coming off the bench.

If we were able to somehow get Camby as well:

Douglas
LBJ
Gallinari or Chandler (depending on the match ups)
Bosh
Camby

Plan B

Douglas
Joe Johnson
Chandler
Gallinari
Bosh

These guys would thrive in SSOL and when they get a better PG they’ll be even better.

Plan C

Douglas
Manu
Chandler
Gallinari
Camby

And save cap space for mid-year deals or 2011 FAs

Dead Horse meet the NY media and their angry followers.

Yes we should move on because it’s done.

Cry if you like, but I’m pretty sure Jordan Hill, Stephon Marbury, Nate Robinson, Zach Randolph, Jamal Crawford, Larry Hughes, and Renaldo Balkman are NOT walking through that door to save us. Not that any of them did much here anyway.

This chatter is pure masturbation to fill inches of column spaces. The only thing relevant to the future of the Knicks is the these last remaining games and who looks like they are worth keeping and a summer of free agency.

The level of armchair psychoanalysis in the media of D’antoni or any NY coach and athlete would be funny if it wasn’t cited as reason #1 lots of players and coaches avoid NY. The Mecca of sports with knives out.

Big city, big market, heaven for journalist to roam free. Take it or leave it.

Jared Jeffries had high praise for Mike D’Antoni and believes that the Knicks will turn around under his coaching.

“I think Mike is an incredible coach,” Jeffries said. “Once he gets the pieces that he needs, I think that he’s going to do very well here.”

Jeffries said that D’Antoni cares about and preaches defense.

“It’s not like he tells the guys, ‘Don’t go out there and guard anybody, just try to score.’ That’s not the case at all.”

Jeffries, who was traded to the Rockets on deadline day in order to open up more cap room this summer, indicated that the Knicks’ defense is limited by their present personnel.

“I think that Mike’s a realist,” Jeffries said. “Defending, like anything else in the NBA, is a talent level. And you can’t have people that are not great defenders and expect them to be great defenders. Just like you can’t have people that aren’t great scorers and expect them to be great scorers. He put me out there to be a defender and he puts guys out there to be scorers. He does focus on defense, but if you don’t have defensive players, then you’re not going to be a great defensive team.”

Read more: http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/65502/20100322/jeffries_says_dantoni_is_an_incredible_coach/#ixzz0j6N5xtpG

At least until he’s running on his last legs. Good big men are a rare commodity in the NBA. If Hill turns out to be good I don’t wanna say “the Knicks traded him for a plan that didn’t work”. We better be good next year.

We all read this already. The point of it is?

you put Jordan Hill in the same sentence with Marbury, Zach, Craw, Hughes, Nate and Balkman?

Maybe Nate I can see

hit Add too soon.. I meant Nate can come back to haunt us.. Hill too.. they are both young and have careers ahead of themselves..

Not so much the other guys.

you all say the same thing every day… is it that out of the question to respond with the same thing…

i cant understand fans like you.

It must stink to be into sports. Does it make you mad all the time? Does it effect the rest of your life? I imagine you people as the people on the subway who are always angry and glaring at people… or you all live in jersey… the second is prob more likely.

Spot on MrFurious

If it isn’t Hill, its D’Antoni, or Robinson, or Walsh, or Marbury, etc…you get the point. As a life long Knick fan I am hungry for a winner just as much as everyone else, but all this constant carping is getting old. Reminds me of the old ladies that move from New York to Florida to get always from the cold, only to complain about the heat. I guess some people aren’t happy unless they are complaining.

yeah. A compitent management would be able to rip everyone off and never give up anything to get anything.

I demand unrealistic situations where everything magical happens. Like teams wanting JJs contract without anything added in.

And guys like N8 being traded for two quality young players who are actually contributing more then nate did… wait…

What would the “same thing” be? That’s what I’m asking.

see: Comment by Dudemeister
2010-03-24 10:02:47

Open forum, bro. I’m sure you understand the concept. See, this is the place where many different people can have different opinions without passing judgement.
It’s like, that’s what makes internet, like, absolutely, totally AWESOME, dude.
Relax, man, it’s all in good fun.

Oh, I just read it, actually. My question was that, how come in this forum, in Tommy’s words, Hill went from “definitely a part of the future” and Walsh was “really impressed with his game” to “Donnie Walsh was always planning to deal the first pick to move Jeffries if there were no takers for him otherwise”.
I mean, I was jut question how can a rookie with so little minutes in his body have so many different status changes in such a short period of time.

yes… I guess the optimist in me is always discouraged when I see all the negativity always come out in said open forums.

When an downer (I am being nice because you are the least offender and I dont want to call you a jerk, but jerk applies to many of the other members of the Knick Tea-party) says they can be a downer because its a free country, they are right… but they are still a downer.

Vescey is the biggest “little old lady in Florida” of them all. Chronic complainer. While he applauds Milicic’s rebounding skills since the trade, he failed to mention that the Timberwolves are 1 win 15 losses for all of Milicic’s effort. Does he really believe we should have held onto to Milicic as a rotation player?? I don’ think so.

LOL

I guess we should be dancing in the streets?

A parade up the Canyon of Heroes?

Don’t worry there won’t be anything to complain about come July 1st right?

Trust me, we all hope there isn’t.

its a fair question.

like September call ups in baseball I would not put too much credence in what you see in garbage time basketball games.

when/If DVJ sees the 30th win you know he will declare victory..

There’s nothing fun about the “forum” when commenters come on here and rip every single move or non-move the organization makes, but when a fan defends or agrees with any aspect of the team or decision-making, they are accused of drinking “Kool Aid.” The fact is we are all fans, but those who choose to take a positive outlook on the future of the team, or those who aren’t calling for everyone’s head in every thread get mocked for some unknown reason A lot of commenters on here bond over whining about the organization.

I always rather saw myself as “an optimist who quickly sees what’ll probably end up”. After all, we are all in this for the same thing. We’ve all suffered like hell this past decade and all the 90′s (I was lucky enough to remember some one year of the 80′s) and still leave that sweet taste of great players and tough games, but horrible dissapointments.
Faith is the last thing you lose, but sometimes you’ve been around the game long enough to understand what can or can’t be done (whatever goals are set to be achieved). I guess from a different pov my opinion can be pessimistic.
For example, at the beginning of the year I just really wanted small improvement (you know, something like 35-36 W’s, not a lot, just improvement), and by the second week of january you could see how things were coming.

a forum is for a civil exchange of opinions and ideas.. not everyone has the same opinion.

if you want a pep rally go to a local high school

the forum is the most civil around.. “drinking Kool aid” is not name calling.

making snide comments about what people do outside the forum is a bit suspect.

its all good though.. make a point and we’ll discuss… it makes no sense to degrade or insult commenters for their opinions.

Doesn’t mean that you’re at war with whoever has what you call a negative outlook of the team. If you ask them, a lot of them (including myself, I’ve been called a pessimist), say they’re trying to be realistic bacause too many times they’ve set themselves up for dissapointment, you know? They’ll also say that everything’s for the sake of good discussion and a nice interchange of opinions.

If I can, I’ll take the 1st Camby scenario, though it seems unlikely because of money issues. It looks great though.

i wish we would have at least given Darko the chance that D’Antoni claims he got. when he said “we tried Darko in their for a bit”

Still, in Walker’s example, although there’s no way to tell how his performance is gonna be like next season, his contract’s cheap enough to keep around as an asset.
It’s Giddens who I’m not sold on.

Fair points. This is for Biggie, too, because you guys are both actually knowledgable commenters, despite sometimes coming off pessimistic: I’m totally down for well thought-out debate, and I see many of the points that you both make. I’m just saying, when every thread gets hijacked with D’Antoni bashing, or saying how screwed we are if we don’t get a superstar, it takes away from the conversation and gets tired, IMO. Unfortunately, I fully realize that commenters like DVJ, who are so blindly optimistic and delusional, make it easy for some of the hopeful optimists to be grouped together with the “Kool Aid” drinkers – which also contributes to the problem.

i get ya.. Im not sure hijacked is the right word..

I can remember last summer when Bob, HaS and myself were the few voices of dissension in this forum ..

we just pressed on and made the points without regard to the general consensus that this was a playoff team in 2009.

Yeah, I remember. You, as well as HaS and Bob stood strong behind your point, and it panned out unfortunately for all of us. I only wanted 4-5 more wins. But hey, it’s bball, or better, it’s the Knicks.
I do have issues with this coach, but like everyone else, I know he’ll be around. What I do wonder is how tight his leash’s gonna be. You gotta expect it to be tighter depending on the team receives.
But if I was DW, if I gave him an all around competitive team with 2 great players but no James or Wade, I would still demand for immediate results and a 2st-4rd seed team. You gotta wonder how much patience and leniency will this coach have if the W’s aren’t consistent.
Mind you, an all around competitive team with 2 great players. Which, imo, is either plan B or C for Walsh. Imo, it’s highly doubtful that DW wants to save cash for 2011

Lol.
I can only imagine what type of comments there’ll if this team gets to 30.

i think the leased will be much tighter with the fans than than Donnie obviously.

I like this blog and I laugh at some of the comments (the cowabunga stuff gets me every time) but at times, it’s unreadable. The Dantoni bashing, no matter the topic at hand, gets tedious. Why not stick to what the the post topic is.

I screamed about playing Hill/Douglas all year long, but it didn’t happen. Dantoni’s reasoning might have to do with Douglas learning the PG spot or Hill showing up to summer league and camp out of shape and looking lost early in the season. I don’t really know but no point in dwelling on it.

Most ol’ school coaches don’t play rookies. JVG never played rookies — doesn’t mean he’s a bad coach. The same applies to Dantoni. I will judge him next year. But failing at coaching expirings or not playing a rookie is not something I’m going to hold against him. I stay on that big picture thinking.

One last thing, Darko sucks. Go through his entire game log with the Wolves instead of cherry-picking 2 games he played well. That game log is his career in a nutshell. 12.2 PER with the wolves on a per minute basis.(league average is 15) Like I said, he’s not any good.

“The Hill questioning is Fair.. in light of what Darko is doing in Minny after not seeing the light of the day from this “coach’s” dog house.. ”

The Hill questioning is fair, and D’antoni should have cleared more minutes for him, but you’re overrating Darko and there are only so many minutes. Give the minutes to Hill, screw Darko. Just because you see a few blocks in the box score does not mean Darko is doing anything in Minne. The Wolves are 1-16 since he was traded and STILL worse than the Knicks defensively.

The fact that Darko thinks he’s entitled 30-35 starter minutes and “have the ball in his hands and have an offense run through” him only lends credence to why he was in D’antoni’s “dog house.”

[...] apparently thought Darko was lazy and mailed it in. There’s no credibility to that assertion. I know Tommy Dee routinely noticed that Darko was always the first player off the court after practice, but what does he know, he’s just a [...]